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Do you find over proroduced albums are damaged by the production

Very much so19
A little18
It Helps an album a little11
Production makes music flowless7
Has no affect5

Total votes: 60


The original post

Posted by on 29.08.2006 at 09:53
Im a big fan of production i think albums need good production to produce the right sound... But what happens when an album is over-produced (I find this with alot of roadrunner album... and im not saying this to bash Roadrunner, god knows they get it enough elsewhere) But iv noticed over recent months the negative effect of over-producing an album...
I find it takes away from atmosphere esspecially, And in extreme cases it makes albums sound almost robotic and unhuman... I'll offer examples of this so you can decide for yourself... Feel free to add your own

Nightwish - Once (Its a great album and i love it start to finnish, But its just so perfect, it almost sounds robotic, the stmosphere on this album was quite good though so i cant really offer alot of negatives on it.

Opeth - Ghost Reveries (Another album i love... But once again its lost alot of atmosphere compared to the likes of Still Life and earlier opeth albums. And once again, the musicianship sounds so robotic, perfectly performed, with no noticable flaws)

Satyricon - Now Diabolicle (This is not to bash Satyricon at all, i like this album dispite it being a bm sellout... But compare to every other Satyricon album this has by far the worst atmospere to it... However i must admit the vocals were very catchy)

So production is important IMO, but producer need to find the ballance...
Other reasons for critisising over-production is that it covers up how good a band really is...

What do you guys think?
Are there any other instances where over-production has damaged what is otherwise a brilliant album?



Page 3 of 3

Guib

Posts: 2062

Age: 23
From: Canada

  15.01.2013 at 22:41
Well I voted ''A Little'' Since there was no (It Depends on the Situation and Band) lol because I don't think that ''Over-Production'' if this actually exist (but I understand what you mean) does damage an album because it depends on how it has been done and it depends alot on the band's energy, vibe and general feeling. I mean sometimes it can sound emotionless thats for sure, but other times it helps the sound alot. I think it depends on the style you're playing and you have to adapt your production to your sound. Anyways thats my opinion.
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theFIST

Posts: 845

Age: 21
From: Austria

  15.01.2013 at 23:32
Producing a high quality sound with too little distortion can hurt albums extremely
for example the old S.v.e.s.t. songs sounded amazing, the ones on the split with deathspell omega rather ridiculous
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Written by Warman on 07.11.2007 at 22:39
Haha, that's like saying "compose your own Metal album and upload it here, instead of writing a review of an album".
squidrick420

Posts: 187

Age: 22
From: USA

  21.01.2013 at 03:35
Production almost kills the spirit of the music! I say this because i have heard several re-masters/re-makes of old albums that lost the ambiance of the original recordings. All production does is distort the sound of the band into however they want to sound, whether or not it is actually how they sound. In the words of Varg Vikernes "I am not flawless so neither is my music."
Iamawalker

Posts: 255
From: Norway

  21.01.2013 at 13:57
Hmm, it very much depends. For me there is a negativity in the word over-production. Even though some of my all-time favorite albums are considered over-produced by the majority, perhaps, I still wouldn't use that word for some reason. I'm not sure why. If the production totally works then I can't really define it as such even though it does make sense. IMO most of the albums labeled in this way seem more polished than over-produced. So for me it appears to be more about wether or not you like the more polished-sounding albums as opposed to those of a more gritty character. Also, where do we draw the line? Aren't most albums being recorded these days over-produced when compared to 80's-releases? Oh well, hell if I know. On a sidenote we can all agree on the fact that most of, if not all, these sugary "cool today, lame tomorrow" hip-hop albums are pretty much made for such a term.
skrog1

Posts: 111
From: USA

  10.03.2013 at 01:05
Here's the thing: MOST metal bands when they first start out don't want to spend any money on a recording. They think their brother's sister's drunk boyfriend with a digital eight track is good enough to get them signed. BULLSHIT. If I'm going to listen to anything, it had better sound good. Better than the last thing I listened to, as a matter of fact. There are very, VERY few bands who can pull off a "raw" sound (and for those not in the know, "raw" really translates into "shitty").

...And NO your band isn't one of them.


Spend some time. Spend some money. Record something decent worth listening to. And stop worrying about over-production. If you have a budget under $10k, you're not over produced.
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skrog1

Posts: 111
From: USA

  10.03.2013 at 01:08
Speaking of production, I'm going to use Lamb of God as my example. EVERY SINGLE ALBUM BY THEM SOUNDS LIKE SHIT. I don't care who wants to sit and debate me. I've listened to them all. New American Gospel all the way up to their most recient. Their drum kit sounds terrible. Their guitars sound... gross. Randy's vocals are completely lackluster.

Now, compare them to LoG live..? Live, they're excellent. Very good. Good sound, too. IMO, it's like LoG wants to try so hard to have a different tone that they said, Ok, let's just crank the mids on everything and smash the lows and boost the obnoxious highs. Yeah, that doesn't sound like anything I've ever heard before! Let's sell it!

:/
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Guib

Posts: 2062

Age: 23
From: Canada

  10.03.2013 at 01:12
Written by skrog1 on 10.03.2013 at 01:05

Here's the thing: MOST metal bands when they first start out don't want to spend any money on a recording. They think their brother's sister's drunk boyfriend with a digital eight track is good enough to get them signed. BULLSHIT. If I'm going to listen to anything, it had better sound good. Better than the last thing I listened to, as a matter of fact. There are very, VERY few bands who can pull off a "raw" sound (and for those not in the know, "raw" really translates into "shitty").

...And NO your band isn't one of them.


Spend some time. Spend some money. Record something decent worth listening to. And stop worrying about over-production. If you have a budget under $10k, you're not over produced.


Hey dude, what about the fact that some band who actually ''enjoy playing music'' yes yes, cuz it does exist you know. Just don't have the money to get produced properly because they're not necessarily all rich kids to which dad pays off everything, which in that case explains the ''raw'' sound which YOU believe is shit, because remember that opinions and tastes are subjective and none here cares about YOUR standards for what is good or bad music lol. You're a walking stereotype.
----
- I love my technical, melodic, my thrash, agressive and fast paced, my sludge, well thought, my heavy, heavier and my metal, ever-growing -
skrog1

Posts: 111
From: USA

  10.03.2013 at 01:14
No, I'm not a walking stereotype. You're just an insecure name caller.

And anyone who "enjoy's playing the music" can take the extra time, GET A FRICKIN JOB, and spend a little on producing something worth listening to.
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Guib

Posts: 2062

Age: 23
From: Canada

  10.03.2013 at 01:17
Written by skrog1 on 10.03.2013 at 01:14

No, I'm not a walking stereotype. You're just an insecure name caller.

And anyone who "enjoy's playing the music" can take the extra time, GET A FRICKIN JOB, and spend a little on producing something worth listening to.


Dude when you're living alone, having night-school while working full time... paying bills and shit... well good luck having the money to pay a 10k production lol. C'mon lets face it the reason why some bands are under-produce, its not the will to have it done properly thats lacking, its the means or just because they actually do enjoy a more nasty sound. You are generalizing like if any starting band could pay off a top notch production or like if your tastes should be applied to any metal band. THAT, my friend, is bullshit.
----
- I love my technical, melodic, my thrash, agressive and fast paced, my sludge, well thought, my heavy, heavier and my metal, ever-growing -
skrog1

Posts: 111
From: USA

  10.03.2013 at 01:24
No, I never said any starting band had to pay off a top notch producer with a $10,000 budget. READ WHAT I SAY a little more closely, dude. The thread is about over production. I said anyone under a $10,000 budget doesn't need to worry about being over produced. Period. That pretty much sums up every starter band unless they're rich.

Now, as far as "living alone, having night-school while working full time... paying the bills and shit..." yeah, you just summed up EVERY start up metal band. It's called being patient and saving your pennies. You know what a savings account is, right Guib? They're usually free at most banks. See, you can afford to put some money away every paycheck and before you know it, bingo! You'll have a couple grand! Go invest in your music! Having a hard time putting $5, 10, or even 20 a week away? Well, stop smoking. Or cut back. Stop drinking beer/liquor for a couple of months. It's not hard. Stop buying weed for a few weeks. Funny how these things can add up. It's not hard to save money.

Especially if you're in a BAND with more than one person.
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Guib

Posts: 2062

Age: 23
From: Canada

  10.03.2013 at 01:28
Written by skrog1 on 10.03.2013 at 01:24

No, I never said any starting band had to pay off a top notch producer with a $10,000 budget. READ WHAT I SAY a little more closely, dude. The thread is about over production. I said anyone under a $10,000 budget doesn't need to worry about being over produced. Period. That pretty much sums up every starter band unless they're rich.

Now, as far as "living alone, having night-school while working full time... paying the bills and shit..." yeah, you just summed up EVERY start up metal band. It's called being patient and saving your pennies. You know what a savings account is, right Guib? They're usually free at most banks. See, you can afford to put some money away every paycheck and before you know it, bingo! You'll have a couple grand! Go invest in your music! Having a hard time putting $5, 10, or even 20 a week away? Well, stop smoking. Or cut back. Stop drinking beer/liquor for a couple of months. It's not hard. Stop buying weed for a few weeks. Funny how these things can add up. It's not hard to save money.

Especially if you're in a BAND with more than one person.


Oh don't worry I know all about saving money. But I was pointing ONE side, I still think alot of bands like sounding ''raw'' and some bands don't have the same impact when they sound like a Power Metal band's production. I was just trying to tell you that there's not only 1 reason, and that it is not necessarily Bullshit just because they don't have such a GREAT production. If no one ever payed attention to those ''raw'' or ''shitty'', like you said, well alot of great names wouldn't be known nowadays.
----
- I love my technical, melodic, my thrash, agressive and fast paced, my sludge, well thought, my heavy, heavier and my metal, ever-growing -
skrog1

Posts: 111
From: USA

  10.03.2013 at 01:33
If we're talking about "demos" versus "albums" then I think we agree. A demo is a quick, unfunded recording that's a freeby. Giveaway. Usually something to hand out to people at shows just to get a name out there. That's fine. Don't make a person pay for that. But if someone's actually going to put out an "album" and expect to sell it and make money... See previous responses.
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Guib

Posts: 2062

Age: 23
From: Canada

  10.03.2013 at 01:35
Written by skrog1 on 10.03.2013 at 01:33

If we're talking about "demos" versus "albums" then I think we agree. A demo is a quick, unfunded recording that's a freeby. Giveaway. Usually something to hand out to people at shows just to get a name out there. That's fine. Don't make a person pay for that. But if someone's actually going to put out an "album" and expect to sell it and make money... See previous responses.


Well what about Venom ? Celtic Frost ? Metallica's Kill 'Em All ? Onslaught ? Kreator's early releases (like Pleasure to kill for instance) or early Testament ? or Possessed ?

Lol I mean their production ain't that great lol still legends. I would even dare say the poor production helped them.
----
- I love my technical, melodic, my thrash, agressive and fast paced, my sludge, well thought, my heavy, heavier and my metal, ever-growing -
skrog1

Posts: 111
From: USA

  10.03.2013 at 01:39
Noooooooooo.... NO, no no no nono. No. You're completely changing words around here, dude. Every single one of those bands' first albums were cut in a professional studio with a budget of some sort. What I was talking about was completely different. Kill 'Em All is a GREAT example of what I'm talking about, Guib. James, Lars, Kirk, and Cliff ransacked every penny they could scrape together to go into a studio and cut a decient record. See, you're trying to compare those albums made in the late '70's/early '80's by today's production standard. That's not what I'm talking about. I'm talking about bands that are too lazy or stupid to save their money and do the exact same thing as the bands you just mentioned. They just want to throw a boombox in a corner and hit "record." Or "hire" on some nobody schmuk who THINKS he's a producer and pay $100 and think they've got a pro recording. There's a big difference.
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Lit.
Brütal Legend

Posts: 3675

Age: 27
From: USA

  10.03.2013 at 18:07
I laugh at the poor fools who think production makes a difference.
Ha ha.
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Thought Police

Posts: 15000

Age: 30
From: UK

  10.03.2013 at 18:13
Written by Lit. on 10.03.2013 at 18:07

I laugh at the poor fools who think production makes a difference.
Ha ha.

Production makes an immense difference to the quality of an album. In fact sometimes if can be the difference between a great album and a shit one.
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Lit.
Brütal Legend

Posts: 3675

Age: 27
From: USA

  10.03.2013 at 18:16
Written by !J.O.O.E.! on 10.03.2013 at 18:13

Written by Lit. on 10.03.2013 at 18:07

I laugh at the poor fools who think production makes a difference.
Ha ha.

Production makes an immense difference to the quality of an album. In fact sometimes if can be the difference between a great album and a shit one.

Really? I haven't noticed.
----
REPUBLICAN CAR!
!J.O.O.E.!
Thought Police

Posts: 15000

Age: 30
From: UK

  10.03.2013 at 18:24
Written by Lit. on 10.03.2013 at 18:16

Really? I haven't noticed.

Then you must have been spoiled by listening to too many overly polished, sterile production albums
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Skandino

Posts: 15200

Age: 21
From: Sweden

  11.03.2013 at 15:35
I laugh at the poor fools who think production doesn't makes a difference.
Ha ha.



Seriously, that's fucking retarded. A bm album with hospital-clean production or a prog one with extremely dirty production... Things like that usually leads to a disaster in sound.
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Like you could kiss my ass
Written by Milena on 20.06.2012 at 10:49
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SuicidalCyco
No Mercy

Posts: 490

Age: 20
From: USA

  12.03.2013 at 03:57
Written by skrog1 on 10.03.2013 at 01:39

Noooooooooo.... NO, no no no nono. No. You're completely changing words around here, dude. Every single one of those bands' first albums were cut in a professional studio with a budget of some sort. What I was talking about was completely different. Kill 'Em All is a GREAT example of what I'm talking about, Guib. James, Lars, Kirk, and Cliff ransacked every penny they could scrape together to go into a studio and cut a decient record. See, you're trying to compare those albums made in the late '70's/early '80's by today's production standard. That's not what I'm talking about. I'm talking about bands that are too lazy or stupid to save their money and do the exact same thing as the bands you just mentioned. They just want to throw a boombox in a corner and hit "record." Or "hire" on some nobody schmuk who THINKS he's a producer and pay $100 and think they've got a pro recording. There's a big difference.


Venom? I dont really think they were in a really professional studio with a budget, their Welcome to Hell album sounds like shit, which is one reason I love it. And almost all black metal sounds like shit too because of the recording, but thats how they want and like it. And it sounds good. Sepultura's Schizophrenia album has awful production but its a righteous album, one of my favorites by them, it makes it sound raw and almost hardcore. I think there is a lot more to production than sound. Take into account all of the hardcore punk bands of the 80s. Most of them were on their own labels, with their own recording, and a lot of it is bad recording, same with black metal, but them displaying their DIY ethics shows that you dont need a huge studio with lots of money to produce an album, sure it sounds better if thats what you like, either way, I think it just depends on the kind of music it is and what you like. But I think you need to lighten up a bit man, trust me.
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Marcel Hubregtse
Grumpy Fuck

Posts: 36551

Age: 46
From: The Netherlands

  12.03.2013 at 13:02
Written by SuicidalCyco on 12.03.2013 at 03:57



Venom? I dont really think they were in a really professional studio with a budget, their Welcome to Hell album sounds like shit,


it was recorded in a professional studio with a budget and a producer (Keith Nichol) The reason it sounds like it sounds is because the band wanted it to sound like that and the producer and technicians in the studio adhered to the band's wishes
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SuicidalCyco
No Mercy

Posts: 490

Age: 20
From: USA

  13.03.2013 at 06:30
Written by Marcel Hubregtse on 12.03.2013 at 13:02

Written by SuicidalCyco on 12.03.2013 at 03:57



Venom? I dont really think they were in a really professional studio with a budget, their Welcome to Hell album sounds like shit,


it was recorded in a professional studio with a budget and a producer (Keith Nichol) The reason it sounds like it sounds is because the band wanted it to sound like that and the producer and technicians in the studio adhered to the band's wishes


Yeah and I think it sounds great like that. They knew what was up.
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