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The original post

Posted by whatsacow on 11.11.2012 at 16:27
I've come to a conclusion. All these metalheads banging on about how they only listen to one style of metal, or just metal in general are idiots. I know this is not going to be a popular opinion on this site, but I feel like it needs to be said. I love metal, I adore it, and it is my favourite genre. However, there are plenty of other genres out there that warrant our attention. Just because something is not metal doesn't mean it's evil. Even within the metal circle, certain genres are just plain hated, no matter how talented they are. I don't know how many times I've heard a really original and talented band get completely trashed by metalheads just because it has origins in metalcore or nu metal. Closing off an entire sub-genre just because you don't perceive it as metal is close-minded, stupid, and in the end, it is you who are missing out.

Anyway, those are my opinions. What are yours? Do you agree with me or disagree? I know this thread will cause arguments but please try and keep it civil, and remember that both viewpoints are welcomed.



Page 3 of 3

Ozman
Grumpy Fuck

Posts: 36850

Age: 46
From: The Netherlands

  20.11.2012 at 07:27
Written by Guib on 20.11.2012 at 04:11

Written by whatsacow on 20.11.2012 at 02:28

Written by Ozman on 19.11.2012 at 23:30

Written by Guib on 19.11.2012 at 23:20

and it seems it only applies to thrash, if theres new bands doing Death, Power, Prog, Doom, Sludge (whatever) metal its okay but when its thrash it must suck. Wtf's going on with all of you


Simple it doesn't really suck but it is just sooooo mediocre unlike in the otheer genres you mentioned PLus within thrash they try to copy the old bands way too much (even when compared to doom, but not osdam but they just rip it up unlike the new thrash bands somehow)

Marcel, I seem to recall my first contact with you was through you ragging on the fact that I liked Shape of Despair lol.

And Thrash still has some great albums. Look at Machine Head's: The Blackening.


Or look at vektor's black future, Sacred ally's reality hammer, Revocation's chaos of forms
(...) -_- Marcel is a part-time elitist


Sacred Ally is mediocre, Revocation I am not even going there concerning whether they are thrash or not and at that good thrash and Vektor are a poor man's Voi Vod
----
Member of the true crusade against European Flower Metal

Yesterday is dead and gone, tomorrow is out of sight
Dawn Crosby (r.i.p.)
05.04.1963 - 15.12.1996

whatsacow

Posts: 2021

Age: 22
From: Australia

  20.11.2012 at 07:35
Written by Ozman on 20.11.2012 at 07:26

Written by whatsacow on 20.11.2012 at 02:28

Written by Ozman on 19.11.2012 at 23:30

Written by Guib on 19.11.2012 at 23:20

and it seems it only applies to thrash, if theres new bands doing Death, Power, Prog, Doom, Sludge (whatever) metal its okay but when its thrash it must suck. Wtf's going on with all of you


Simple it doesn't really suck but it is just sooooo mediocre unlike in the otheer genres you mentioned PLus within thrash they try to copy the old bands way too much (even when compared to doom, but not osdam but they just rip it up unlike the new thrash bands somehow)

Marcel, I seem to recall my first contact with you was through you ragging on the fact that I liked Shape of Despair lol.

And Thrash still has some great albums. Look at Machine Head's: The Blackening.


MH's The Blackening is okay but nothing special since it is way too drawn out

"Too drawn out" says the fan of Esoteric...
----
When God made up the golden rule, do you think he noticed that it condones rape?
Ozman
Grumpy Fuck

Posts: 36850

Age: 46
From: The Netherlands

  20.11.2012 at 07:41
Written by whatsacow on 20.11.2012 at 07:35

Written by Ozman on 20.11.2012 at 07:26


"Too drawn out" says the fan of Esoteric...


with Esoteric it doesn't get boring due to the nature of the music whereas with Machine Head and also Exodus nowadays it does get boring. Those bands should get a proper producer in who will trim the fat off the long songs, making those songs punch home then. That's the problem with MH that Robb Flynn wants to do everything, also the productional side of things.
----
Member of the true crusade against European Flower Metal

Yesterday is dead and gone, tomorrow is out of sight
Dawn Crosby (r.i.p.)
05.04.1963 - 15.12.1996

whatsacow

Posts: 2021

Age: 22
From: Australia

  20.11.2012 at 07:50
Written by Ozman on 20.11.2012 at 07:41

Written by whatsacow on 20.11.2012 at 07:35

Written by Ozman on 20.11.2012 at 07:26


"Too drawn out" says the fan of Esoteric...


with Esoteric it doesn't get boring due to the nature of the music whereas with Machine Head and also Exodus nowadays it does get boring. Those bands should get a proper producer in who will trim the fat off the long songs, making those songs punch home then. That's the problem with MH that Robb Flynn wants to do everything, also the productional side of things.

An argument could be made for taste, as I quite like some of the 10 minute tracks on MH's album anyway. A lot of people going into funeral doom would think it's just the same shit over and over again. I know that you are a fan of both genres, I'm just saying that it's kind of more of a taste thing here.
----
When God made up the golden rule, do you think he noticed that it condones rape?
Guib

Posts: 2066

Age: 23
From: Canada

  20.11.2012 at 15:48
Written by Ozman on 20.11.2012 at 07:27

Written by Guib on 20.11.2012 at 04:11

Written by whatsacow on 20.11.2012 at 02:28

Written by Ozman on 19.11.2012 at 23:30

Written by Guib on 19.11.2012 at 23:20










Sacred Ally is mediocre, Revocation I am not even going there concerning whether they are thrash or not and at that good thrash and Vektor are a poor man's Voi Vod


Yeah in your opinion it is.
----
- I love my technical, melodic, my thrash, agressive and fast paced, my sludge, well thought, my heavy, heavier and my metal, ever-growing -
R'Vannith
Spiralmind

Posts: 2895

Age: 23
From: Australia

  20.11.2012 at 16:51
Voivod have been a poor man's Voivod for a while now. I'd prefer Vektor to anything post "Phobos"
Mr. Doctor
Skandino

Posts: 15320

Age: 22
From: Sweden

  20.11.2012 at 19:50
Written by Guib on 20.11.2012 at 15:48
Yeah in your opinion it is.


Like everything that has been posted on any music forum on existence. I can't stop wondering why do you guys even quote each other. Pointless for both sides.
----
Written by BloodTears on 19.08.2011 at 18:29
Like you could kiss my ass
Written by Milena on 20.06.2012 at 10:49
Rod, let me love you.
Guib

Posts: 2066

Age: 23
From: Canada

  20.11.2012 at 21:16
Written by Mr. Doctor on 20.11.2012 at 19:50

Written by Guib on 20.11.2012 at 15:48
Yeah in your opinion it is.


Like everything that has been posted on any music forum on existence. I can't stop wondering why do you guys even quote each other. Pointless for both sides.


Well thats what i said on one of my previous posts, that it was pointless
Cuz none of us is gonna change his mind lol. But yeah whatever.
----
- I love my technical, melodic, my thrash, agressive and fast paced, my sludge, well thought, my heavy, heavier and my metal, ever-growing -
Iamawalker

Posts: 255
From: Norway

  21.11.2012 at 00:41
I fully agree with the original post, and I realize I'm guilty of this as well. I know for a fact that I like a lot of Pop/Rock and stuff like that, but it's like I don't want to totally embrace it or welcome it for some reason. I've just closed myself within the branches of Melodic Metal and that's my turf, just like that. I think it boils down to the fact that we have things that feel safe, we don't want to change sometimes even if it's for the better, so to sort of justify our choice we condemn everything else or a particular thing. I think we at least do all this on a subconscious level, but perhaps this example is exagerated some bit... And I'm not even sure where I'm going with this either but whatever.
Personally I've just grown into this mindset that Melodic Metal is the holy grail of music, even though I know perfectly well I'm missing out. I'd rather immerse myself within that style and become obsessed with that in particular, rather than skimming all genres of music on the surface, but that's just me. And I know by doing it thos way, I'm missing out on some truly great stuff, or at least potentially enjoyable stuff.
Edmund Fogg

Posts: 1752

Age: 27
From: Canada

  21.11.2012 at 01:56
Written by Iamawalker on 21.11.2012 at 00:41

I'd rather immerse myself within that style and become obsessed with that in particular, rather than skimming all genres of music on the surface, but that's just me.


We all have a different approach to music. I'm a skimmer myself, but it doesn't make neither you, me or Marcel elitsts for that reason. As long as the critcism, hatred etc.. doesn't turn in obsession and is directed towards bands and not fans I guess it remains pretty harmless.
----
You cannot sedate all the things you hate - MM
The Observer is the source of reality - Bloom
God damn it!! What did Diddy didn't do? - Satan
Iamawalker

Posts: 255
From: Norway

  21.11.2012 at 03:07
Written by Edmund Fogg on 21.11.2012 at 01:56

We all have a different approach to music. I'm a skimmer myself, but it doesn't make neither you, me or Marcel elitsts for that reason. As long as the critcism, hatred etc.. doesn't turn in obsession and is directed towards bands and not fans I guess it remains pretty harmless.


I completely agree with you. It's very nice with these different approaches, that we can all pick up something from each other, or find out about how we all enjoy music.
whatsacow

Posts: 2021

Age: 22
From: Australia

  21.11.2012 at 14:52
Written by Iamawalker on 21.11.2012 at 00:41

I fully agree with the original post, and I realize I'm guilty of this as well. I know for a fact that I like a lot of Pop/Rock and stuff like that, but it's like I don't want to totally embrace it or welcome it for some reason. I've just closed myself within the branches of Melodic Metal and that's my turf, just like that. I think it boils down to the fact that we have things that feel safe, we don't want to change sometimes even if it's for the better, so to sort of justify our choice we condemn everything else or a particular thing. I think we at least do all this on a subconscious level, but perhaps this example is exagerated some bit... And I'm not even sure where I'm going with this either but whatever.
Personally I've just grown into this mindset that Melodic Metal is the holy grail of music, even though I know perfectly well I'm missing out. I'd rather immerse myself within that style and become obsessed with that in particular, rather than skimming all genres of music on the surface, but that's just me. And I know by doing it thos way, I'm missing out on some truly great stuff, or at least potentially enjoyable stuff.

I used to notice that I did that too... Anyway, my guitar teacher opened my eyes and showed me that if I wanted to be a good musician, I couldn't listen to just one style of music. He was right, though you don't have to be a musician to appreciate what other genres can teach.

One other extremely dangerous view I've stumbled upon countless times is people who won't even look at something if it's popular. That is tragic. I mean if a band isn't in your tastes, fine, but if I wrote off every popular band, I'd be missing out on some fucking phenomenal albums.
----
When God made up the golden rule, do you think he noticed that it condones rape?
Iamawalker

Posts: 255
From: Norway

  21.11.2012 at 16:38
Written by whatsacow on 21.11.2012 at 14:52

I used to notice that I did that too... Anyway, my guitar teacher opened my eyes and showed me that if I wanted to be a good musician, I couldn't listen to just one style of music. He was right, though you don't have to be a musician to appreciate what other genres can teach.

One other extremely dangerous view I've stumbled upon countless times is people who won't even look at something if it's popular. That is tragic. I mean if a band isn't in your tastes, fine, but if I wrote off every popular band, I'd be missing out on some fucking phenomenal albums.


Yeah man, totally! It seems it has become trendy to hate or pick on particular bands as well. Saying you enjoy Metallica anywhere on a youtube video for instance, would almost be equivalent to commiting blasphemy. It's like a lot of Metal fans are afraid that the music they enjoy is enjoyed by the majority, maybe to do with feeling special or something?
It seems lots of people are obsessed with the words "overrated" and "underrated" in particular. And then you have all the comparison being drawn between bands. It's like someone can't enjoy new Helloween stuff, because now they have Unisonic and feel they're better. It has become a narrow-minded view indeed, where people just take from here and take from there, only what they think sound good immediately, unknowing that the real art might be lost in the stuff that needed multiple listens for instance. I think the Internet Age is partially to blame, maybe a little bit. Sure, I wouldn't know 1/3 of the bands I listen to without internet, but the precious-ness is not the same as I guess it were 15-20 years ago. When buying an album was something special, you waited for it, you had paid for it so you gave it multiple spins (This applies for me today and might be for you too, just talking fans in general). Today the internet has made things a bit too easy for a lot of people.

Again, I don't know exactly where I'm going, I guess this is more of a brain-storm unleashing of random thoughts.
Sorry, if it's off-topic!
Angelic Storm
Melodious

Posts: 6656
From: UK

  25.11.2012 at 15:54
I can only agree wholeheartedly with the above post. I think the whole problem with some metal fans, is their overwhelming need to be seen as a "hardcore" or "true" metal fans. This is why some people bash Metallica for selling out, but praise Megadeth unwaveringly as if they somehow also didn't sell out. Also, the same people claiming that Dave Mustaine was wholly responsible for the first two Metallica albums. Helloween, again, I'm sure there are some people who don't even give the Andi Deris stuff a chance, purely because they think that stating a love only for the Kai/Kiske stuff, makes them appear like they are more "hardcore".

Most of the time now, I think it's impossible for me to be surprised by such mindsets, but I was very wrong, after reading a youtube comment this morning reffering to Sepultura's "Arise" album as "mallcore". Sheesh...
Guib

Posts: 2066

Age: 23
From: Canada

  25.11.2012 at 17:28
Written by Angelic Storm on 25.11.2012 at 15:54

I can only agree wholeheartedly with the above post. I think the whole problem with some metal fans, is their overwhelming need to be seen as a "hardcore" or "true" metal fans. This is why some people bash Metallica for selling out, but praise Megadeth unwaveringly as if they somehow also didn't sell out. Also, the same people claiming that Dave Mustaine was wholly responsible for the first two Metallica albums. Helloween, again, I'm sure there are some people who don't even give the Andi Deris stuff a chance, purely because they think that stating a love only for the Kai/Kiske stuff, makes them appear like they are more "hardcore".

Most of the time now, I think it's impossible for me to be surprised by such mindsets, but I was very wrong, after reading a youtube comment this morning reffering to Sepultura's "Arise" album as "mallcore". Sheesh...


So true about helloween. I dont get it either especially because i love alot
Of the stuff that was done with derris. Anyways we cant change how people
Think we can just hope that they'll eventually realize how useless it is to
Think that way especially when talking about music in general.
----
- I love my technical, melodic, my thrash, agressive and fast paced, my sludge, well thought, my heavy, heavier and my metal, ever-growing -
Edmund Fogg

Posts: 1752

Age: 27
From: Canada

  26.11.2012 at 02:52
Problem is, for every fan that grows out of this "phase", two more enters it.
----
You cannot sedate all the things you hate - MM
The Observer is the source of reality - Bloom
God damn it!! What did Diddy didn't do? - Satan
Guib

Posts: 2066

Age: 23
From: Canada

  26.11.2012 at 14:30
Written by Edmund Fogg on 26.11.2012 at 02:52

Problem is, for every fan that grows out of this "phase", two more enters it.


Arg dont see it like this its a depressing thought lol.
----
- I love my technical, melodic, my thrash, agressive and fast paced, my sludge, well thought, my heavy, heavier and my metal, ever-growing -
skrog1

Posts: 111
From: USA

  10.03.2013 at 03:24
I've ran into more close-minded, ignorant metalheads in my life than I care to recall. "I'm right, you're wrong." That's the motto of so many elitists... It's sad. I have my opinions on what's shit and what isn't (Guib and I have had a few discussions about this) but the bottom line is - if you dig it, then cool. I live in a free country. I respect people's opinions. I may whole-heartedly disagree but so what? I'm not right and neither are you. That's the nice thing about opinions.
----
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http://facebook.com/Skrogband
Skøllgrim
Northern

Posts: 353


  10.03.2013 at 19:33
I think it's importnant to note that metalheads have different subcultures as well as the music.
I like some metal, but some genres I despise and the same goes for some of the metalheads.
----
"Popbutikk med platt lyrikk
Skit vil ingen hava"

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