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Military Service



Posts: 19   Visited by: 37 users

Poll

It Should Be Mandatory Or Profesional?

Profesional
7
Other
6
Both
2
Mandatory
1

Total votes: 16
01.11.2014 - 16:46
Bad English
Tage Westerlund
Since Europe has living in the peace and fight whit some trouble makers in desert sends, send a bomber plain and SEAL team to clean rets of tangos, we did not need armies as in cold war. But now after Russian aggression in Georgia, Ukraine, occupation of Crimea, Rus supported terrorists use SAM and destroyed civilian ari plain. Rus plains entering Swe and Fin airspace, every day they are close to Baltic when NATO plains needs get up and identify. Now when France want sell modern Mistral war ship to Rus, and days when they strategically bombers and plains, hade big exercise In European space (maybe nuke attack test) (read yeteday news) , and I wont hide I see Rus as big treath to region and our safety unless VP wont be taken out)
Days when Swe and Fin wants join in NATO( I wont hide, both nations should be there and and good scenario Ausie, NZ as well, since Ausie has good military stuff)
Day when Isis is not taleban in Afga who needs cross big distances, days when N Africa are troubled, can our professional army and solders protect us? Its not a secret not a Ger, not a FRance , maybe even UK cant fight alone, only unite as NATO. Finland has better potential and reserves as Germany has---

To me, as grow up in peace and no wars, when NATO protects us and Rus was week(no I was not born in Swe) , mandatory service name pissed me of, even now it does, but my country army and national guard has modernized , no more soviet bullshit , new recruit rape and so on, since we have profs , but now I am thinking. Modern days if you drop mandatory, no hair cut, no other ''broke people personality'' weapon training, tactics, otrher basics, not 1-2years , 3 months after 5 years repeat all, it wont do bad, men and women needs to know how fire a weapon, defied Europe.
same time we need prof army as well , because modern day profs are better as any mandatory army solders , or MS user (Marcel maybe knows what I mean ) are there and , 80% of guys maybe fire a gun once, if some 11 November brigade attack to them they wont be ready to defend no battle simulation, nothing. Army f 1000000 people whit out experience can be defeated by 10 000 whit battl experience.
We still need profs who operate ships, plains, SAM and so on -.--

So now my thoughts are chancing, and after ''Rus sub'' near Swe cost , Swe start talk, how about mandatory military survive---
Well big mistake is cut military budged, solders need 40 000 even more krones after tax pay to they stay at army
----
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01.11.2014 - 16:49
Bad English
Tage Westerlund
And I also see Isis and troubles in N Africa as enemy, well small situation, in medeterenia, Greece, Italy , Spain, Portugal, economics small, what so ever attack, (I hope never happens) can damage their economics and hole EU in total ..... and such case we ordinary people will feal it most...
----
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25.12.2014 - 09:37
KRS Porlaneff

Military service would be optional. Here in Brazil you need to sign, but I knew by friends that was more than a waste of time because 90 percent are kicked at the end of the year and a half service.
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26.12.2014 - 17:32
Bad English
Tage Westerlund
Written by KRS Porlaneff on 25.12.2014 at 09:37

Military service would be optional. Here in Brazil you need to sign, but I knew by friends that was more than a waste of time because 90 percent are kicked at the end of the year and a half service.


Brazil has no enemy, only what can be is criminal gangs, cartels etc, but there are BOPE and other special forces.
But I think it can be army job go in there and clean out favelas
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05.01.2015 - 09:15
M C Vice
ex-polydactyl
Written by deadone on 05.01.2015 at 05:51

Written by KRS Porlaneff on 25.12.2014 at 09:37

Military service would be optional. Here in Brazil you need to sign, but I knew by friends that was more than a waste of time because 90 percent are kicked at the end of the year and a half service.



It's meant to provide a pool of personnel that can be called up in times of emergency and brought up to full standard in a short period of time compared to fresh recruits with no military training.

The conscript system can work very well if implemented correctly - look at Israel where such service is compulsory for the most part.

Basically cannon fodder for if (or when) WW3 breaks out. Numerical superiority is still a great tactical advantage.
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05.01.2015 - 14:30
Bad English
Tage Westerlund
Written by M C Vice on 05.01.2015 at 09:15


Basically cannon fodder for if (or when) WW3 breaks out. Numerical superiority is still a great tactical advantage.


when WWIII brake out you will see US and NATO allies and aliens work together whit new B2 type bomber plane what is 100% invisible, or new climate controller satalite what can send minus 100¤C to Syria or plus 77¤C to Moscow , or new staletice what brakes down enemy communication ... that's what will happen in WWIII
----
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06.01.2015 - 02:05
Bad English
Tage Westerlund
Written by deadone on 05.01.2015 at 23:53

Written by M C Vice on 05.01.2015 at 09:15

Basically cannon fodder for if (or when) WW3 breaks out. Numerical superiority is still a great tactical advantage.



Your average Israeli conscript is still one of the best soldiers on the planet. In WWII the German conscript based system produced superb troops.

Conscripts get a bad rap but when trained effectively are excellent soldiers.


Isreal has best army in the word and nukes and other countries specially arabs are afraid , even Iran are afraid, and I believe Israel will use nuke if something as 9/11 would happen in isreal
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06.01.2015 - 02:28
Troy Killjoy
perfunctionist
The way wars are fought these days it isn't about who has the best-trained soldiers, it's about who has the best technology and equipment.
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06.01.2015 - 02:43
Bad English
Tage Westerlund
Written by Troy Killjoy on 06.01.2015 at 02:28

The way wars are fought these days it isn't about who has the best-trained soldiers, it's about who has the best technology and equipment.


That's what I try to say here like months
small non pilot plains for camera intel, radios, modern satellites, GPS, smart bombs , night visons ... now solders more less are profs (and Greek mandatory military's service is joke, one year in army and you fire one time a assault rifle ehh), trained, equipped, like primary weapon, M4 Carbine for example , secondary weapon, military shout gun, and thirdly weapon , pistol, can use tomahawk as well
I just saw nuw bullet what US gun company made, look at lex facebook wall , if it goes to head it be mess
But still those wars, when it goes against taleban or skinnies , it works, if NATO needs fight Russia , well that's why EU should not sold them ay technology what can be used in military
Even US disremote from F 16 what gave to Iraqi, basically those are second generations fighter jets

BTW Canadain forces needs solders, maybe you wanna join
----
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Stormtroopers of Death - ''Speak English or Die''
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06.01.2015 - 02:57
Troy Killjoy
perfunctionist
Written by Bad English on 06.01.2015 at 02:43
BTW Canadain forces needs solders, maybe you wanna join

Fuck that.
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"Wise men talk because they have something to say; fools because they have to say something."
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06.01.2015 - 02:58
Bad English
Tage Westerlund
Written by Troy Killjoy on 06.01.2015 at 02:57

Written by Bad English on 06.01.2015 at 02:43
BTW Canadain forces needs solders, maybe you wanna join

Fuck that.


You don't want be in a army? its like job? you're young, fit, strong man, you can handle

BTW your boys defended 4 months my origin country airspace. be a pilot we can meet / meat (never can remember witch one is right one at this situation)
----
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Stormtroopers of Death - ''Speak English or Die''
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I better die, because I never will learn speek english, so I choose dieing
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06.01.2015 - 03:01
Troy Killjoy
perfunctionist
Written by Bad English on 06.01.2015 at 02:58
You don't want be in a army? its like job? you're young, fit, strong man, you can handle

Ya I'm not really big on the whole military service thing.
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"Wise men talk because they have something to say; fools because they have to say something."
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06.01.2015 - 03:08
Bad English
Tage Westerlund
Written by Troy Killjoy on 06.01.2015 at 03:01

Written by Bad English on 06.01.2015 at 02:58
You don't want be in a army? its like job? you're young, fit, strong man, you can handle

Ya I'm not really big on the whole military service thing.


neither do I,
I have astma , I be dead in such training, and I don't want to cut hair
but if war situation dictates I can take gun and defend my country ,
My old man was sortha in army, he had job what in US secret service do , big man barn, we have a woman than,
it was under military , now its MP job

I have tried many guns, pistols, assault rifles, light infantry weapons BTW

EDDIT: I did SAS walk well sortha I did not cary 20kg bag and 20kg iron bar as Ausie SAS ask, but I walk 23km
----
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Stormtroopers of Death - ''Speak English or Die''
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06.01.2015 - 03:43
Troy Killjoy
perfunctionist
Written by deadone on 06.01.2015 at 03:36
We've got a lot of problems in Australia with youth drug and alcohol abuse as well as social welfare dependency. National service would get kids away from corrupt influences and teach kids how to work. The discipline would be good too.

Plenty of people I know in service over here have an alcohol dependency and access to hard drugs is a well-known problem as well, particularly in the small community postings such as Cold Lake and Gagetown.

Besides, the idea of having a bunch of older men yelling at me and making me do general labor tasks for showing up late or for not saluting a higher ranking official or for not making my bed in the morning doesn't seem like something that would make me strive to achieve better self-discipline. Military "authority" is hilarious and that kind of structure is the reason I didn't pursue a military career despite a long history of relatives who served. The year I spent as a cadet was the biggest joke of my life.
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"Wise men talk because they have something to say; fools because they have to say something."
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06.01.2015 - 04:00
Troy Killjoy
perfunctionist
Written by deadone on 06.01.2015 at 03:54
True. However this could be monitored. Measures could be put in place. Not all militaries are full of drunks.

What other alternatives are there? Especially when we have engrained social welfare dependency and substance abuse that spans generations. How do you break the cycle? Whilst they are in their own social circles, they continue to behave that way.

Also the shouting etc doesn't need to happen. There are other systems available - look at the Israelis (mosty NCOs/trainers are women).

These are hypothetical arguments though. These things COULD be monitored and measures COULD be put in place, but that currently isn't the way things are here. Even still, our military isn't full of alcoholics and drug addicts, but the military isn't exempt from these issues.

As for alternatives, there aren't many. Military service works for some, it doesn't for others. Much like all forms of rehabilitation and prevention and reduction.

And again, it may or may not need to happen, but that's how things are here. I'm only arguing what I know about the Canadian military, I have no clue about how things are done in Israel because it has literally zero impact on my decision to avoid military service in Canada.
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"Wise men talk because they have something to say; fools because they have to say something."
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06.01.2015 - 04:10
Troy Killjoy
perfunctionist
Written by deadone on 06.01.2015 at 04:05
Great examples of how training is critical. Without training technology is nothing.

Were the Viet Cong more technically sound when it came to training or were they simply more willing to lay their lives on the line when it came to fighting for what they believed in. I don't remember reading many articles about their advanced training techniques, I think it had more to do with US soldiers fighting for something they didn't necessarily believe in and weren't as willing to risk their lives for that cause whereas the Viet Cong fought with pride and an almost suicidal form of defense.
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"Wise men talk because they have something to say; fools because they have to say something."
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06.01.2015 - 04:21
Troy Killjoy
perfunctionist
Written by deadone on 06.01.2015 at 04:13
Something needs to be done. We've got sizeable and growing chunks of society becoming writeoffs almost at birth. It's just as bad in parts of America.

This is getting off-topic but it doesn't help when so many jobs are outsourced to other countries and millions of citizens don't have access to proper education (for all kinds of different reasons) and are essentially without options at that point, even if they're privileged enough to know they have options. Americans take pride in separating their government from business and social services whereas Canadians prefer to have our government in control of most of those things - both of which have their pros and cons of course. I think when the government is in charge of creating programs and funding agencies that help reduce those write-offs you speak of, that's a good thing. When they're left to their own devices, sometimes they aren't as fortunate. And while it could be argued that it's simply a matter of survival of the fittest, that simply isn't the case. Otherwise we'd be living in more of a Chrysalids type of society.

Is there another topic for this kind of discussion? Wouldn't mind continuing it there.
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"Wise men talk because they have something to say; fools because they have to say something."
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06.01.2015 - 12:21
Bad English
Tage Westerlund
Written by deadone on 06.01.2015 at 03:36

Written by Troy Killjoy on 06.01.2015 at 03:01

Written by Bad English on 06.01.2015 at 02:58
You don't want be in a army? its like job? you're young, fit, strong man, you can handle

Ya I'm not really big on the whole military service thing.



I think some sort of national service would be good for a lot of kids today (and myself when I was a kid).

Doesn't have to involve carrying guns. It could be community work albeit with military type discipline.

We've got a lot of problems in Australia with youth drug and alcohol abuse as well as social welfare dependency. National service would get kids away from corrupt influences and teach kids how to work. The discipline would be good too.


China do same to PC game addicts IMO, I have read it
I wonder what they do whit ppl whit 40K posts
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Stormtroopers of Death - ''Speak English or Die''
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02.07.2022 - 23:35
Joppe
Steelemeister
I did participate in it, and now I would be, if a war starts one of those cannon fodder type of soldiers. I never anticipated that there would ever be some kind of conflict possible in the past, if I did I would never went there. It always seemed to me that the finnish army is only a symbolic force that would never have any active combat purpose, that it would only have an indirect or passive effect to show that nobody should ever start a war against a big military nation. Now I am forced to change my stance about it, I can't agree with the current geopolitic developments, I have no part in NATO and in actions of the government; they are playing with fire, they are breaking the friendship treaty between finland and russia. I have no beef with russians, I am forced to resign. If it's mandatory, there are still other options. So I guess I vote "other"
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