Rating:
8.7
Darkthrone - Dark Thrones And Black Flags
20 October 2008


01. The Winds They Called The Dungeon Shaker
02. Oath Minus
03. Hiking Metal Punx
04. Blacksmith Of The North
05. Norway In September
06. Grizzly Trade
07. Hanging Out In Haiger
08. Dark Thrones And Black Flags
09. Launchpad To Nothingness
10. Witch Ghetto


It's another year and that means another offering from Darkthrone's dynamic duo of Gylve "Fenriz" Nagell and Ted "Nocturno Culto" Skjellum. Their latest opus, "Dark Thrones and Black Flags" marks their fifth release in the last six years and their 14th release since 1991's "Soulside Journey."

"Dark Thrones…" continues to see the band fuse elements of their traditional sound as well as their metal and punk influences into one caustic witches brew. The end result is that "DKaBF" sounds like the bastard union of their take on the more traditional metal sound of "F.O.A.D." with the bombast and energy of their crustpunk influenced "The Cult is Alive" - and it's a damn enjoyable album.

Their latest effort clocks in at the usual near 40 minutes, this time with a full 10 tracks whereas in the past most Darkthrone albums had six to eight songs. The end result is songs that are shorter, more driven, and more to the point.

The strongest aspect of the new album is the guitar work. Guitar duties were split between Nocturno and Fenriz, and it seems both showed up at Necrohell II studio with their "A" material. For the most part, the songs are dynamic, shifting riffs and tempos, and each song as at least one really cool riff that makes you take notice. Nothing earth-shattering that will have <insert your favorite axe deity here> furrowing his brow and spending hours sequestered in the back of the tour bus trying to decipher, but good, solid metal craftsmanship that will have you tossing the horns and raising some pints.

Vocal duties, as with the riff creation duties, were split between Gylve and Ted. The vocals were slightly annoying at first as they're all recorded a little heavy on the reverb, but that was easy to get used to/over on repeated listens. They do get a bit expressive at times, much to my chagrin, as with the slightly over dramatic chorus to the opening track… "the winds… they called… THE DUNGEON SHAKERRRRRRR!!!, but it all adds to the enjoyment of the album.

Fenriz put in a Fenriz-like performance behind the kit, with the drums pounding along, propelling the songs forward purposefully. As with the riffing, nothing fancy, just a good workmanlike skins to back-up the riffs and keep the energy high.

Production is pretty much what you'd expect from Darkthrone. They've their own portable studio. They pick a weekend, they each bring their respective instruments and a couple cases of beer, meet up, plug in, and get to recording. Nothing fancy here, folks.

I've used the phrase "nothing fancy" a couple times over the course of this review because "Dark Thrones and Black Flags" isn't anything fancy. It's Darkthrone. It's ugly. It's rough. It's dirty. And I wouldn't have it any other way.

If you like the direction Fenriz and Nocturno Culto have taken since "Hate Them", by all means, check this out. If you're one of those that don't like anything they've recorded since "Panzerfaust", maybe your time would be better spent raiding your mom's make-up cabinet and posing in your back yard at night with whatever implements of landscaping you have handy.

Stand out tracks: "The Winds…", "Oath Minus", "Norway in September", and "Witch Ghetto"

Performance: 9
Songwriting: 9
Originality: 8
Production: 8


Band profile: Darkthrone
Album: Dark Thrones And Black Flags


 



Written on 30.10.2008 by
BitterCOld
BitterCOld has been officially reviewing albums for MetalStorm since 2009.
More reviews by BitterCOld ››



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Turin Turambar - 31.10.2008 at 09:18  
Yhm, for me this album deserve maybe for 8, but I prefer old stuff like "Under A Funeral Moon" or "Transilvanian Hunger". This album for me, it's a worse copy of F.O.A.D., more slower, less agresive ( if this possible ). But it's still Darkthrone, so value to have this album.

And fact, "Norway in September" kick ass.
BestMetalstormer - 31.10.2008 at 11:10  
This band never make me dissappointed for their stuff. I gotta get this one. Their song titles really are captivating
Damnated - 31.10.2008 at 11:41  
This indeed turned out to be a good album. strange that i was never a fan of their black metal stuff but i like this new sound. i should re-listen to their newer albums tbh.
Mr. Doctor - 31.10.2008 at 14:38  
Sounds really good. If FOAD was already good and you said this one is better... I gotta buy this one too.
ArcesseEum - 31.10.2008 at 15:02  
These guys are washed up... they need to put down the weed and rethink their careers - its never too late. Ihsahn is still making a fool of himself out there too, I dont know whats wrong with just taking it easy.
enumaelis - 31.10.2008 at 16:03  
I didnt like too much old Darkthrone, but this punk metal they are doing now... :S much less.
Shouldnt they change their shirts to "True norwegian punk" instead of "black metal"?:-X:lol:
Southern Wind - 31.10.2008 at 23:23  
Another awesome album by Darkthrone... I think I'll never get tired of their newer sound
Uirapuru - 31.10.2008 at 23:41  
'im not a huge fan of their new sound.. but its Darkthrone after all, its always worth a listen, the review makes it even more promising.
Very cool cover also.
laucian - 01.11.2008 at 02:02  
Faaaar from what i was expecting..terrible sound, no atmosphere at all, cliche riffs, nothing creative..
Doc Godin - 01.11.2008 at 02:11  
I really like the direction they've been taking recently, I liked what I heard on FOAD, so it sounds like I'll probably like this.
Big_Evil - 01.11.2008 at 11:02  
HIKING METAL PUNKS!!

Good album, not a huge fan of their, well, Trans. Hunger stuff. And people, don't give me that 'tr00 kvlt' BM shit, lol. Good review man.
Finsterwuerden - 02.11.2008 at 16:52  
Sounds like a record from a schoolband, wich want to sound metallike to me. No atmosphere....
John Barleycorn - 03.11.2008 at 01:38  
I almost worship Darkthrone's attitude and this album is also quite cool musically. I still like "The Cult is Alive" more with its overwhelming punk influence. The new album is too metal
I, braineater - 03.11.2008 at 05:31  
Written by John Barleycorn on 03.11.2008 at 01:38

The new album is too metal


LOL

I think if you liked Sardonic Wrath and The Cult is Alive, but thought F.O.A.D was a bit off, you'll definitely enjoy this one. I liked F.O.A.D, but it was pretty hit and miss, and apart from a few songs, I don't really listen to it much these days - unless I'm drunk and want a Fenriz sing a long..

DTABF has great riffs as expected, and does resemble the two albums before F.O.A.D but with a slightly more serious tone than that record (though not overly - it is still Darkthrone after all). Granted you can hear the influence of last year's effort on this too. Quite a few tracks stand out, but 'Norway in September' is a new instant classic for the lads imo. Belting pace throughout too, only the instrumental title track seems a bit like filler - the rest is pretty killer. I'd give it a strong 8.
Judas - 03.11.2008 at 12:47  
I loved the last two releases, so looks like I'd best go pick this one up too.
amarchand - 07.11.2008 at 22:39  
Hahaha love the last paragraph, very good review my friend, obviously this album isn't monumental but it doesn't have to be, that's what the darkthrone classics like TH, UAFM, ABITNS, etc are for
Dangerboner - 08.11.2008 at 03:24  
Has anyone mastered the art of taking the fucking booklet out of the case yet? I'm talking about the specific jewel case on FOAD and DTaBF.
Doc Godin - 08.11.2008 at 03:33  
Written by Dangerboner on 08.11.2008 at 03:24

Has anyone mastered the art of taking the fucking booklet out of the case yet? I'm talking about the specific jewel case on FOAD and DTaBF.

You mean those weird ass jewel box cases with the rounded edges? and you have to push the one edge thinger for it to pop open? Those cases having been popping up all over lately, I'm quite fond of them. I usually just use my thumb to push inwards (towards the hinge) and it pops out from underneath the first set of tabs, then just pull it out....damn that sentence made no sense.
S.K.Ø.M - 26.12.2008 at 20:27  
Its really very nice album ....and hope make its way through the MS awards...and at least take a POSITION better than Satyr. TAON
Dark Seraphim - 27.12.2008 at 07:20  
Great album, really enjoyed it. On first listen every song sounded good. I love the chorus on "The Winds They Called The Dungeon Shacker" I think that Darkthrone have their tongue firmly rammed into their cheeks now but still sound good. A solid 8
Himann - 26.02.2009 at 12:06  
Bah, its alright. Certainly not up to the level their older albums were but it had its moments.
Slayer666 - 10.04.2009 at 11:31  


Quote:

If you like the direction Fenriz and Nocturno Culto have taken since "Hate Them", by all means, check this out. If you're one of those that don't like anything they've recorded since "Panzerfaust", maybe your time would be better spent raiding your mom's make-up cabinet and posing in your back yard at night with whatever implements of landscaping you have handy.


Or, you could do that, and get this album of Metal Storm because it's clearly not Metal. It's freakin'' crust punk with a very, very, very few miserable BM influences.
Mr. Doctor - 10.04.2009 at 18:32  
Written by Slayer666 on 10.04.2009 at 11:31

Or, you could do that, and get this album of Metal Storm because it's clearly not Metal. It's freakin'' crust punk with a very, very, very few miserable BM influences.




I'm sorry, but I don't really see the point of your comment. We all know what kind of music Darkthrone is playing. And also there are many people who see this album and the previous ones metal enough.
BitterCOld - 10.04.2009 at 19:17  
Written by Slayer666 on 10.04.2009 at 11:31



Quote:

If you like the direction Fenriz and Nocturno Culto have taken since "Hate Them", by all means, check this out. If you're one of those that don't like anything they've recorded since "Panzerfaust", maybe your time would be better spent raiding your mom's make-up cabinet and posing in your back yard at night with whatever implements of landscaping you have handy.


Or, you could do that, and get this album of Metal Storm because it's clearly not Metal. It's freakin'' crust punk with a very, very, very few miserable BM influences.


and I will challenge you the same way I challenged the other poster that claimed that "Death Magnetic" is not metal...

explain to me how it is not metal.

list for me critical elements of what metal is, and list for me how this album deviates from those standards.
Slayer666 - 23.04.2009 at 20:40  
Written by BitterCOld on 10.04.2009 at 19:17

Written by Slayer666 on 10.04.2009 at 11:31



Quote:

If you like the direction Fenriz and Nocturno Culto have taken since "Hate Them", by all means, check this out. If you're one of those that don't like anything they've recorded since "Panzerfaust", maybe your time would be better spent raiding your mom's make-up cabinet and posing in your back yard at night with whatever implements of landscaping you have handy.


Or, you could do that, and get this album of Metal Storm because it's clearly not Metal. It's freakin'' crust punk with a very, very, very few miserable BM influences.


and I will challenge you the same way I challenged the other poster that claimed that "Death Magnetic" is not metal...

explain to me how it is not metal.

list for me critical elements of what metal is, and list for me how this album deviates from those standards.

Uhm, OK. That's easy. Check out the way the guitar is used. Nothing compared to old Darkthrone. Tehniques are those that are used primarily in punk. Check the drums. The most classic punk beat. No atmosphere, no in-depthness, just pure mindless punky guitar slashing that my freind who bought his guitar a week ago could play perfectly. And my 7 year-old cousin could easely do the drumms. And the vocals.... oh, the vocals. The guy is shouting like a maniac, with absolutely no thought about how it fits with the rest of the music. Compare it to The Misfits. Sure, DTaBF is rawer, dirtier, but that's about it.
Oh, and the lyrics..... Childish, idiotic, completely parodic... If I didn't know better, I would have thought that the entire album is a parody to BM. And yet, it got elected as THE BEST BM album of 2009. I for one, took that almost personaly.

Fenriz, Occulto get off whatever you're on, and record another Transilvanian Hunger! Now!
Mr. Doctor - 23.04.2009 at 21:47  
Written by Slayer666 on 23.04.2009 at 20:40

Oh, and the lyrics..... Childish, idiotic, completely parodic... If I didn't know better, I would have thought that the entire album is a parody to BM.


There are ten as much of shitty lyrics than good lyrics in BM...
BitterCOld - 24.04.2009 at 07:24  
Complexity is not necessarily a trademark of Punk vs. Metal as well.

they have stated repeatedly in interviews how they went "primitive" following "Soulside Journey" ... the title track to "Transilvanian Hunger" is hardly complex or difficult. if your "friend with a guitar for a week" hasn't figured it out yet, perhaps he should trade in his guitar for guitar hero...

the fact is black metal is partially an offshoot of punk. Quorthon was pretty clear in describing how Charged G.B.H's "City Baby Attacked By Rats" was a huge influence on the first Bathory records. (Grindcore is another offshoot of punk, fwiw)

this album is an amalgamation of punk, old school metal, and black metal.

perhaps YOU hear punk in the riffs because of your background, but as someone who has listened to punk rock since a full 8-10 years before you were even born, i hear more metal in those riffs than the simple power chord bashing of old GBH, Exploited, Misfits, et all. - while there are plenty of power chords being bashed in "DTaBF", there are plenty of tremolo-picked single note runs, and those - coupled with string bends - are more out of Celtic Frost's playbook.

your last statement was your most telling. "TH2" ain't happening. boo hoo for you.
Slayer666 - 24.04.2009 at 11:36  
Written by Mr. Doctor on 23.04.2009 at 21:47

Written by Slayer666 on 23.04.2009 at 20:40

Oh, and the lyrics..... Childish, idiotic, completely parodic... If I didn't know better, I would have thought that the entire album is a parody to BM.


There are ten as much of shitty lyrics than good lyrics in BM...

True, but these lyrics are MORONIC, not shity. There is a difference. You might call some lyrics "shity", but that would also apply to some cheesy, not-too-inteligent ones. OK, so they are not exactly top-notch, but they, unlike these lyrics, don't make fun of the music they stand for, and are not suited for 10 year old kids. I mean, Whitch Ghetto? Hikin Metal Punx? Hanging Out In Haiger? What is this? Names of South Park episodes?
Mr. Doctor - 24.04.2009 at 15:26  
Written by Slayer666 on 24.04.2009 at 11:36

What is this? Names of South Park episodes?


Nope, sense of humor that is...

If you're a dude who finds his music way too serious... Then there's no meaning of giving a fuck for Darkthrone since they play music not for serious guys but for the ones that truly enjoy music just for fun.

You said "make fun of the music they stand for"... I've read the lyrics. And I don't see jokes about metal but about posers. I do see some funny coments about Black Metal, but then again... They don't play BM as you said it. So that means the coment I just quoted is totally useless.
Slayer666 - 24.04.2009 at 16:56  
Written by Mr. Doctor on 24.04.2009 at 15:26

Written by Slayer666 on 24.04.2009 at 11:36

What is this? Names of South Park episodes?


Nope, sense of humor that is...

If you're a dude who finds his music way too serious... Then there's no meaning of giving a fuck for Darkthrone since they play music not for serious guys but for the ones that truly enjoy music just for fun.

You said "make fun of the music they stand for"... I've read the lyrics. And I don't see jokes about metal but about posers. I do see some funny coments about Black Metal, but then again... They don't play BM as you said it. So that means the coment I just quoted is totally useless.

You're wrong. There IS a meaning of giving a fuck for Darkthrone, seeing how they used to make amaizing "serious music". I've been through a whooole lot of BM albums, and none of them create the atmosphere Transilvanian Hunger does. I mean, they went from TH to this.... "album". I find absolutely nothing even vaguely enjoyable about it.
This comment is useless? What a stupid thing to say. Aren't all comments on this site useless? Are they going to change anything? No, I don't think so. Comments are just posted so other people know what you think about the subject. How can an opinion of a person you don't even know be "usefull"? You have the damn review, that's all the usefull information there is.
Mr. Doctor - 24.04.2009 at 18:14  
Written by Slayer666 on 24.04.2009 at 16:56

You're wrong. There IS a meaning of giving a fuck for Darkthrone, seeing how they used to make amaizing "serious music". I've been through a whooole lot of BM albums, and none of them create the atmosphere Transilvanian Hunger does. I mean, they went from TH to this.... "album". I find absolutely nothing even vaguely enjoyable about it.
This comment is useless? What a stupid thing to say. Aren't all comments on this site useless? Are they going to change anything? No, I don't think so. Comments are just posted so other people know what you think about the subject. How can an opinion of a person you don't even know be "usefull"? You have the damn review, that's all the usefull information there is.


Dude, take some pills.... I'm not writing to you like I'm the master of the universe so you should be calm

Your reason to why you give a damn for the new darkthrone... I can't see nothing more that just whining from a fan of the older albums.
If that's the best reason you can give...

And what do you mean with "album"? why the quotation mark?

You didn't understand why I put the word "useless", did you?.
Maybe I didn't explain myself so good... I put another word then.
It's absurd that you are whining about how "they make fun of a genre they stand for" since you wrote at the same time that they are not black Metal and not even metal now... You're just contradicting yourself.

And in case you meaned the older albums... There are so many bands that hate what they did in the past. But do the fans care about it? No.

Cheers.
BitterCOld - 24.04.2009 at 19:31  
Your first three black metal albums are often hailed as landmark masterpieces, while your later releases seem to get less stellar treatment from fans. (Personally, I'm a fan of your later output. Some may take it as heresy, but I slightly prefer them.) Would you be willing to share your thoughts on this? Does it bother you or do you care nothing at all about it?

People that take corpse paint photos in their back yard like albums 2-5 best, motorhead fans, crust punks, and people with large record collections like THE CULT IS ALIVE best. But you know, the first steps towards the REAL forest life is at least going out in the back yard..


____________________________________
Mr. Doctor - 24.04.2009 at 23:21  
Written by BitterCOld on 24.04.2009 at 19:31

But you know, the first steps towards the REAL forest life is at least going out in the back yard..


That's probably my favorite Fenriz' quote. It's exactly what I feel about BM and music in general.
You start with pretentious stuff, it's normal... And then learn to just listening/playing whatever you want jsut because you love it.
Lord_Regnier - 25.04.2009 at 02:06  
I don't like anything Darkthrone have done since "Panzerfaust" but I won't bash the band for it. I just choose to ignore their new stuff and stick to their first 3 albums (I don't take into account "Soulside Journey" here because it's Death Metal).

And this situation with Darkthrone is one more proof that Black Metal is music and not any kind of religion or special way of life like those 'Tr00 kvlt' kids pretend it is.

Of course, I would prefer by far if Darkthrone still played BM but those who say Darkthrone are posers are wrong. They still play underground music. Unfortunately for me, it's a kind of underground music that doesn't fit my tastes at all.
Slayer666 - 25.04.2009 at 12:34  
Written by Lord_Regnier on 25.04.2009 at 02:06

I don't like anything Darkthrone have done since "Panzerfaust" but I won't bash the band for it. I just choose to ignore their new stuff and stick to their first 3 albums (I don't take into account "Soulside Journey" here because it's Death Metal).

And this situation with Darkthrone is one more proof that Black Metal is music and not any kind of religion or special way of life like those 'Tr00 kvlt' kids pretend it is.

Of course, I would prefer by far if Darkthrone still played BM but those who say Darkthrone are posers are wrong. They still play underground music. Unfortunately for me, it's a kind of underground music that doesn't fit my tastes at all.

Exactly my point! I don't want them to play good-old BM because it's "a way of life", but because I like it a 1000 times more than this new crap. And crap it is. Darkthrone used to be about magnificent atmosphere, not this new "True Norvegian Punk".
Lord_Regnier - 25.04.2009 at 17:34  
Written by Slayer666 on 25.04.2009 at 12:34

Exactly my point! I don't want them to play good-old BM because it's "a way of life", but because I like it a 1000 times more than this new crap. And crap it is. Darkthrone used to be about magnificent atmosphere, not this new "True Norvegian Punk".


I still respect Fenriz and Nocturno Culto for their BM legacy (what people usually call Darkthrone's BM trilogy) and for their attitude (they are not sellouts).

However, their old stuff is infinitely better than this crust punk crap they're doing nowadays. Darkthrone is dead since a long time already, from a BM point of view. I find it sad when great BM bands turn into crap years later like that but there's nothing we can do about it. All we can do is listen only to their old stuff and eppreciate it.

It's the same for Satyricon. Their old albums are awesome, while their recent ones are utter crap.
Old Satyricon is awesome, but new Satyricon sucks.
Old Darkthrone is awesome, but new Darkthrone sucks.
Then act as if the new stuff never existed and listen only to the old stuff. If you can't enjoy their old albums because their new ones suck, then you're probably one of those people who believe BM is more than music, so you can't help but to despise the bands because they're 'not tr00 anymore' and it affects your perception when you listen to their old albums. There's a significant 'cut' in Satyricon's music after "Nemesis Divina" and there's a significant 'cut' in Darkthrone's music after "Transylvanian Hunger". When it comes to both bands, I listen only to their BM era. Not because it's 'tr00 kvlt' stuff, according to some people (I don't give a fuck at that 'tr00 kvlt' concept), but because it's BM, my favorite musical genre. On their more recent albums, both bands play a kind of music I dislike and have no interest for. Simple as that.
Slayer666 - 25.04.2009 at 22:25  
Written by Lord_Regnier on 25.04.2009 at 17:34

Written by Slayer666 on 25.04.2009 at 12:34

Exactly my point! I don't want them to play good-old BM because it's "a way of life", but because I like it a 1000 times more than this new crap. And crap it is. Darkthrone used to be about magnificent atmosphere, not this new "True Norvegian Punk".


Then act as if the new stuff never existed and listen only to the old stuff. If you can't enjoy their old albums because their new ones suck, then you're probably one of those people who believe BM is more than music, so you can't help but to despise the bands because they're 'not tr00 anymore' and it affects your perception when you listen to their old albums. There's a significant 'cut' in Satyricon's music after "Nemesis Divina" and there's a significant 'cut' in Darkthrone's music after "Transylvanian Hunger". When it comes to both bands, I listen only to their BM era. Not because it's 'tr00 kvlt' stuff, according to some people (I don't give a fuck at that 'tr00 kvlt' concept), but because it's BM, my favorite musical genre. On their more recent albums, both bands play a kind of music I dislike and have no interest for. Simple as that.

The only reason I care about Darkthrone's new stuff is because I'm so dissapointed in it. I, of course, still enjoy the old stuff, but imagine what they could have done if they continued with BM. That's why I hate the new stuff so much.
Lord_Regnier - 25.04.2009 at 23:27  
Written by Slayer666 on 25.04.2009 at 22:25

The only reason I care about Darkthrone's new stuff is because I'm so dissapointed in it. I, of course, still enjoy the old stuff, but imagine what they could have done if they continued with BM. That's why I hate the new stuff so much.


I know what you mean. However, you can't really say "imagine what they could have done if they continued with BM". You and I can't possibly know what would have happened then. Maybe they could have created BM masterpieces better than their old works. Or maybe not at all. You seem to neglect the possibility that the reason of them abandoning BM could be because they had done everything they had to do in this genre. Perhaps they knew they were at a crossroad and knew they would not be able to do better but only plagiate themselves or regress (though I think they regressed anyway when they changed their style).

By the way, I have no lesson to teach you but I believe you should be careful with something: by choosing to care for the new Darkthrone albums and hate them, there's a danger for you to get a growing feeling of bitterness. You could end up hating the whole band one day and loose interest even in their old albums. And I think it would be a pity, because they're very good.

I'm someone who can very easily hate things when they don't fit my tastes but I try as much as possible to ignore things I dislike (I know it's hard sometimes). Things won't change because you hate them but hate put yourself in a bad mood and makes you suffer uselessly.
Mr. Doctor - 26.04.2009 at 01:32  
Written by Lord_Regnier on 25.04.2009 at 23:27

Written by Slayer666 on 25.04.2009 at 22:25

The only reason I care about Darkthrone's new stuff is because I'm so dissapointed in it. I, of course, still enjoy the old stuff, but imagine what they could have done if they continued with BM. That's why I hate the new stuff so much.


I know what you mean. However, you can't really say "imagine what they could have done if they continued with BM". You and I can't possibly know what would have happened then. Maybe they could have created BM masterpieces better than their old works. Or maybe not at all. You seem to neglect the possibility that the reason of them abandoning BM could be because they had done everything they had to do in this genre. Perhaps they knew they were at a crossroad and knew they would not be able to do better but only plagiate themselves or regress (though I think they regressed anyway when they changed their style).


That's the reason to why I usually don't care if a band changes. It's the same with many bands, they just seemed to do everything it was needed. Better to end that way than just being a copy of themselves.
Lord_Regnier - 26.04.2009 at 02:51  
Written by Mr. Doctor on 26.04.2009 at 01:32

That's the reason to why I usually don't care if a band changes. It's the same with many bands, they just seemed to do everything it was needed. Better to end that way than just being a copy of themselves.


I don't entirely agree with the last sentence because, in many cases, even if bands only repeated themselves without much originality, I'd still enjoy their new albums, which is not the case when they change too much.

In this case, I love BM but dislike crust punk, so the new Darkthrone has zero interest for me. If they still played BM, even if it wasn't special, I think I'd still like their new albums, which is surely not the case with crust punk. Personally, when it's something I really like a lot, I don't care if I get more of the same and not something totally innovative each time. At least it's good music that belongs to a genre I like. Also, you cannot ask bands to re-invent themselves with each album, it's not possible.

I prefer good innovation to stagnation, of course, but I also think stagnation is much better than devolution. Many bands that were great before changed only for the sake of changing or changed for worse and started to suck. In such cases, it would have been much more enjoying if they stayed as they were. The perfect example here would be all those Powermetal bands who are turning to hard rock now. They all devolute and start to suck one after the other. If they still played Power/speed Metal, lots of people would still enjoy them but because they change too much it's almost impossible to find any great PM band now and lots of old PM fans are loosing interest almost completely in this genre.

Good innovation­­­> stagnation> devolution
Mr. Doctor - 26.04.2009 at 19:24  
Written by Lord_Regnier on 26.04.2009 at 02:51

-


O well, That's my opinion of course. Since I dislike when bands do the same stuff over and over again and turns up generic. I try to avoid generic music. Although there are exceptions, I can give you that.
Lord_Regnier - 26.04.2009 at 19:47  
Written by Mr. Doctor on 26.04.2009 at 19:24

O well, That's my opinion of course. Since I dislike when bands do the same stuff over and over again and turns up generic. I try to avoid generic music. Although there are exceptions, I can give you that.


When a band still writes very good songs, has its own sound and atmosphere, even if they repeat themselves, I don't consider the band as being generic because they still have something diifferent that makes them stand out and keeps them above the average bands in their genre. It might not be original or innovative but at least the quality is preserved.
What I consider generic is bands who write very average or mediocre songs, have nothing distinctive, and sound like hundreds of other bands. Or when bands dumb down their music and start to play much simplier and basic stuff, as they don't maintain their level but become another sub-par band (thus forgettable), even if they were awesome before.
Slayer666 - 26.04.2009 at 20:01  
Written by Lord_Regnier on 25.04.2009 at 23:27

Written by Slayer666 on 25.04.2009 at 22:25

The only reason I care about Darkthrone's new stuff is because I'm so dissapointed in it. I, of course, still enjoy the old stuff, but imagine what they could have done if they continued with BM. That's why I hate the new stuff so much.


I know what you mean. However, you can't really say "imagine what they could have done if they continued with BM". You and I can't possibly know what would have happened then. Maybe they could have created BM masterpieces better than their old works. Or maybe not at all. You seem to neglect the possibility that the reason of them abandoning BM could be because they had done everything they had to do in this genre. Perhaps they knew they were at a crossroad and knew they would not be able to do better but only plagiate themselves or regress (though I think they regressed anyway when they changed their style).

By the way, I have no lesson to teach you but I believe you should be careful with something: by choosing to care for the new Darkthrone albums and hate them, there's a danger for you to get a growing feeling of bitterness. You could end up hating the whole band one day and loose interest even in their old albums. And I think it would be a pity, because they're very good.

I'm someone who can very easily hate things when they don't fit my tastes but I try as much as possible to ignore things I dislike (I know it's hard sometimes). Things won't change because you hate them but hate put yourself in a bad mood and makes you suffer uselessly.

You think they bailed on BM because they did all they could there? Hardly. A band that made Transilvanian Hunger must have had so much more to contribute to BM than one or two more albums. No, they were, as you say, on the crossroad and decided to take the easier direction. BM must be one of the hardest genres to make in greater quantities (I'm talking classic, unexperimental BM) due to very strict rules of what that music should sound like. But they could have done it, I'm sure. It's just that they choose not to, because, hey, punk is easier.
About me quiting their old albums, don't worry I'm not that kind of a guy.
Mr. Doctor - 26.04.2009 at 21:40  
Written by Lord_Regnier on 26.04.2009 at 19:47

When a band still writes very good songs, has its own sound and atmosphere, even if they repeat themselves, I don't consider the band as being generic because they still have something diifferent that makes them stand out and keeps them above the average bands in their genre. It might not be original or innovative but at least the quality is preserved.
What I consider generic is bands who write very average or mediocre songs, have nothing distinctive, and sound like hundreds of other bands. Or when bands dumb down their music and start to play much simplier and basic stuff, as they don't maintain their level but become another sub-par band (thus forgettable), even if they were awesome before.


We think the same way then. I agree with the logic of "If it's not broken, don't fix it" But I certainly feel like the albums that came after Panzerfaust [except Goatlord since it's DM] were a little "meh" if you know what I mean. So I though that it was time to search for some sort of fresh air again. If the albums were BM like the first albums, I wouldn't care if they stay that way.

Written by Slayer666 on 26.04.2009 at 20:01

You think they bailed on BM because they did all they could there? Hardly. A band that made Transilvanian Hunger must have had so much more to contribute to BM than one or two more albums. No, they were, as you say, on the crossroad and decided to take the easier direction. BM must be one of the hardest genres to make in greater quantities (I'm talking classic, unexperimental BM) due to very strict rules of what that music should sound like. But they could have done it, I'm sure. It's just that they choose not to, because, hey, punk is easier.


I see what you mean.
Even if we can't see the "what if" stuff. I also think about bands that could have been the same way for a few more years or maybe just stick with the style for ever
But what I don't agree with you is the thing that you said about punk. I really don't think they wanted to play it because it was "easy"... But because they wanted to.
Lord_Regnier - 26.04.2009 at 21:52  
Written by Mr. Doctor on 26.04.2009 at 21:40

We think the same way then. I agree with the logic of "If it's not broken, don't fix it" But I certainly feel like the albums that came after Panzerfaust [except Goatlord since it's DM] were a little "meh" if you know what I mean. So I though that it was time to search for some sort of fresh air again. If the albums were BM like the first albums, I wouldn't care if they stay that way.


I identify "Panzerfaust" as the album on which Darkthrone started to change and go away from BM. So yes, it started to be broken at that point and not with the crust punk albums. I would not want them to release something similar to "Panzerfaust" more than crust punk. I don't like either of them.
And yes, it would have been much better if they continued to release stuff like their old BM albums.
Slayer666 - 02.05.2009 at 00:56  
Quote:
Written by Slayer666 on 26.04.2009 at 20:01

You think they bailed on BM because they did all they could there? Hardly. A band that made Transilvanian Hunger must have had so much more to contribute to BM than one or two more albums. No, they were, as you say, on the crossroad and decided to take the easier direction. BM must be one of the hardest genres to make in greater quantities (I'm talking classic, unexperimental BM) due to very strict rules of what that music should sound like. But they could have done it, I'm sure. It's just that they choose not to, because, hey, punk is easier.


I see what you mean.
Even if we can't see the "what if" stuff. I also think about bands that could have been the same way for a few more years or maybe just stick with the style for ever
But what I don't agree with you is the thing that you said about punk. I really don't think they wanted to play it because it was "easy"... But because they wanted to.

Hmm.... Possibly. All the weed must have cought up with 'em after Panzerfaust. A shame, really. I really, really liked Transilvanian Hunger... And I can't get into the new stuff for shit. It's not just the music that annoys me, it's also the way Fenriz and Nocturno treat their music now: as a time-killing hobby, or a simple passtime. I always enjoyed music that was more.... serious.
Mr. Doctor - 02.05.2009 at 02:27  
Written by Slayer666 on 02.05.2009 at 00:56

it's also the way Fenriz and Nocturno treat their music now: as a time-killing hobby, or a simple passtime. I always enjoyed music that was more.... serious.


That's very subjective though... Maybe it's just not serious for you.
Maybe this is jsut a dream!!!!!!!!*


*= Ok.. forget that one. I'm kinda drunk now.
Slayer666 - 02.05.2009 at 13:47  
Written by Mr. Doctor on 02.05.2009 at 02:27

Written by Slayer666 on 02.05.2009 at 00:56

it's also the way Fenriz and Nocturno treat their music now: as a time-killing hobby, or a simple passtime. I always enjoyed music that was more.... serious.


That's very subjective though... Maybe it's just not serious for you.
Maybe this is jsut a dream!!!!!!!!*


*= Ok.. forget that one. I'm kinda drunk now.

Ah....OK. What was the ocasion? Anyway, when you sober-up, check the lyrics again, and tell me (but with all honesty) is it serious.
Or maybe the "dynamic duo" (Fenriz and Nocturno) just became posers.....
Mr. Doctor - 02.05.2009 at 14:30  
Written by Slayer666 on 02.05.2009 at 13:47

Or maybe the "dynamic duo" (Fenriz and Nocturno) just became posers.....


I haven't said that they are serious, just that they are not serious for YOU. Tastes differ, I don't see them as serious... Maybe some people do, who cares? Who really cares about the lyrics when the music itself is just for fun?.
It's like trying to take goregrind lyrics for serious.... It's THAT useless, trust me.

And now I want your definition for Posers... Because even if the genre changed totally, that doesn't mean they are posers.
Valaskjalf - 23.10.2009 at 23:46  
This.....is....not....music.

The only reason people would listen to this is due to the so-called "status" they think it gives them in the metal world. Musically this is fucking crap

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