Thumbs up: +24
Hey everyone.
I used to avoid Black Metal for long since I considered BM musicians as "a bunch of monkeys, wearing corpse paints in a dark frost and pretending to hate humanity". Fortunately, some of them have proven to be more than that. My interest in Black Metal is progressively increasing and now I consider it to be one of the most divers metal genres, among with doom metal. Black Metal albums with experimental elements are more likely to appease me. Admittedly, this list shares a lot with my previous lists.These albums are included to indicate my taste in this genre. One album per band, unless the band's album have very different sound .The main aim of this list is to gain recommendations.

Created by: mz | 04.09.2013



1. Aderlating - Spear Of Gold and Seraphim Bone Pt.1
Blackend Ambient/Noise
2. Agalloch - Ashes Against The Grain
Atmospheric Black Metal
3. Alkerdeel - Morinde
Blackend Sludge Metal
4. Arcturus - The Sham Mirrors
Avantgarde Black Metal
5. Arizmenda - Within The Vacuum Of Infinity...
Psychedelic black Metal
6. Blut Aus Nord - The Work Which Transforms God
Industrial Black Metal
7. Blut Aus Nord - MoRT
Industrial Black Metal (??)
8. Carpe Noctem - In Terra Profugus
Black Metal
9. Cloak Of Altering - Plague Beasts
Experimental Black Metal
10. Cobalt - Eater Of Birds
Black Metal
11. Dark Tribe - In Jeraspunta - Die Rückkehr Der Tollwütigen Bestie
Black Metal
12. Darkspace - Dark Space II
Ambient Black Metal
13. Deathspell Omega - Si Monumentum Requires, Circumspice
Black Metal
14. Emptiness - Nothing But The Whole
15. Enslaved - Axioma Ethica Odini
Progressive Black Metal
16. Glorior Belli - Manifesting The Raging Beast
Black Metal
17. Gnaw Their Tongues - L'Arrivée De La Terne Mort Triomphante
Ambient/Noise Black Metal
18. Godkiller - The End Of The World
Cyber Black Metal
19. Hail Spirit Noir - Pneuma
Psychedelic Rock/Black Metal
20. Infestus - E x I I s t
Atmospheric Black Metal
21. Lord Mantis - Pervertor
Blackend Sludge Metal
22. Lurker Of Chalice - Lurker Of Chalice
Ambient Black Metal
23. Mayhem - Ordo Ad Chao
Black Metal
24. Morpheus Tales - Secular Noir
Progressive/ Psychedelic Black Metal
25. Murmuüre - Murmuüre
Ambient/Psychedelic Black Metal
26. N.K.V.D. - Vlast
Industrial Black Metal
27. Necrite - Sic Transit Gloria Mundi
Drone/ Black Metal
28. Netra - Mélancolie Urbaine
?
29. P.H.O.B.O.S. - Anúdipal
Industrial Black/Doom Metal
30. Plebeian Grandstand - Lowgazer
Black Metal/Hardcore (?)
31. Primordial - To The Nameless Dead
Black Metal
32. Reverence - The Asthenic Ascension
Industrial Black Metal
33. Shining - V - Halmstad
Depressive Black Metal
34. The Meads of Asphodel - The Murder Of Jesus The Jew
Experimental Black Metal
35. The Axis Of Perdition - Deleted Scenes From The Transition Hospital
Ambient/Industrial Black Metal
36. Thorns - Thorns
Industrial/ Black Metal
37. Ved Buens Ende - Written In Waters
Avantgarde Black Metal
38. Verdunkeln - Einblick In Den Qualenfall
Psychedelic Black Metal
39. Weakling - Dead As Dreams
Black Metal
40. Wodensthrone - Curse
Atmospheric Black Metal
41. Wolves In The Throne Room - Two Hunters
Atmospheric Black Metal
42. Woods Of Belial - Deimos XIII
Industial Doom/ Black Metal



Disclaimer: All top lists are unofficial and do not represent the point of view of the MS Staff.
[ More lists by mz ]



Comments

‹‹ Back to the Lists Pages: [1] 2 3
Comments: 117  
Users visited: 139  
Search this topic:  


mz - 04.09.2013 at 13:13  
Once again, recommendations are more than welcomed
mz - 04.09.2013 at 13:17  
The especial name of "Infestus - E x I I s t" makes it impossible to link it correctly to the list because of usage off "|" in the album name.
!J.O.O.E.! - 04.09.2013 at 14:12  
Definitely a very modern list. I've no issue with that.

Suggestions that would not look out of place here:

Arizmenda - Within the Vacuum of Infinity
Black Hole Generator - Black Karma
Brown Jenkins - Death Obsession
Chryst - Phantasmachronica
Cloak of Altering - any album
Code - Nouveau Glaoming
Dark Tribe - In Jeraspunta
De Magia Veterum - any album
Dwellers of the Twilight - Sycophant
Gnome - Silent Scream
Iperyt - No State of Grace
Merrimack - The Acausal Mass
Muknal - Muknal
Nachtmystium - Instinct: Decay
The Ruins of Beverast - Unlock the Shrine
Nagelfar - Hunengrab im Herbst
Negative Plane - Stained Glass Revelations
Netra - Melancolie Urbaine
Ofermod - Mystérion Tés Anomias
Ondskapt - Dodens Evangelium
Ophidian Forest - Redbad
Oranssi Pazuzu - Muukalainen Puhuu
Sjodogg - Landscape of Disease and Decadence
Stagnant Waters - Stagnant Waters
Subvertio Deus - Psalms of Perdition
Sun of the Blind - Skullreader
Surachai - Embraced
S.V.E.S.T. - Urfaust
Transcending Bizarre? - The Four Scissors
(V.E.G.A.) - Cocaine: A Sick Mind's Hologram
V:28 - SoulSaviour
Ved Buens Ende - Written In Waters
Verdunkeln - Einblick in den Qualenfall
Void - Decoding the Messages of the Drones of Halogen Lights
Void - Void (UK)
Walknut - Graveforests and Their Shadows

That'll do....
mz - 04.09.2013 at 14:32  
Written by !J.O.O.E.! on 04.09.2013 at 14:12

Definitely a very modern list. I've no issue with that.

Suggestions that would not look out of place here:

Arizmenda - Within the Vacuum of Infinity
Black Hole Generator - Black Karma
Brown Jenkins - Death Obsession
Chryst - Phantasmachronica
Cloak of Altering - any album
Code - Nouveau Glaoming
Dark Tribe - In Jeraspunta
De Magia Veterum - any album
Dwellers of the Twilight - Sycophant
Gnome - Silent Scream
Iperyt - No State of Grace
Merrimack - The Acausal Mass
Muknal - Muknal
Nachtmystium - Instinct: Decay
The Ruins of Beverast - Unlock the Shrine
Nagelfar - Hunengrab im Herbst
Negative Plane - Stained Glass Revelations
Netra - Melancolie Urbaine
Ofermod - Mystérion Tés Anomias
Ondskapt - Dodens Evangelium
Ophidian Forest - Redbad
Oranssi Pazuzu - Muukalainen Puhuu
Sjodogg - Landscape of Disease and Decadence
Stagnant Waters - Stagnant Waters
Subvertio Deus - Psalms of Perdition
Sun of the Blind - Skullreader
Surachai - Embraced
S.V.E.S.T. - Urfaust
Transcending Bizarre? - The Four Scissors
(V.E.G.A.) - Cocaine: A Sick Mind's Hologram
V:28 - SoulSaviour
Ved Buens Ende - Written In Waters
Verdunkeln - Einblick in den Qualenfall
Void - Decoding the Messages of the Drones of Halogen Lights
Void - Void (UK)
Walknut - Graveforests and Their Shadows

That'll do....

Yeah, it's definitely modern as I somehow hate second wave of black metal.
Regarding the bands you suggested, I've heard Nachtmystium but their "Addicts Black Meddle Pt II", The Ruins of Beverast "Foulest Semen..." (I was actually rechecking this album when you commented here), Sun of the Blind "Skullreader" and maybe a few samples from others like V.E.G.A and S.V.E.S.T. DMV and CoA have also been on my check list since their mastermind is also behind the absolutly fantastic GTT and I have avoided them for no reason more than laziness. Basically I have gotten 25+ new bands to check out. Most of the time your suggestions are pretty good so that means a lot of excellent albums in theory. Thank you
!J.O.O.E.! - 04.09.2013 at 14:36  
Personally, I find Instinct: Decay a thousand times better than Assassins. Very different style. Same goes for that Ruins of Beverast album; I think you'd like Unlock the Shrine and Rain Upon the Impure a lot more.
1Yossarian1 - 04.09.2013 at 14:56  
More hispter BM is definitely needed Try some Wittr, Altar of Plaques, Deafheaven, Vestiges, Panopticon, Encirling Sea, Wildernessking. Locrian, etc

Nice list
!J.O.O.E.! - 04.09.2013 at 14:59  
Written by 1Yossarian1 on 04.09.2013 at 14:56

Locrian

I like this band, but I don't get how they keep getting lumped into the black metal circuit. They have a very best a minor black influence in what is largely experimental drone / ambient music. Not really part of the whole "hipster" black movement either I'd say.
mz - 04.09.2013 at 15:11  
Written by 1Yossarian1 on 04.09.2013 at 14:56

More hispter BM is definitely needed Try some Wittr, Altar of Plaques, Deafheaven, Vestiges, Panopticon, Encirling Sea, Wildernessking. Locrian, etc

Nice list

From hipster BM movement, I like Wolves in Throne Room more than others. Initially, I was meant to include their debut here but postponded it to check their entire discography again and deciede on what's their best. Also,deafheaven was good but nowhere near albums on this list IMO.
BTW, thank you
mz - 04.09.2013 at 15:13  
Written by !J.O.O.E.! on 04.09.2013 at 14:59

Written by 1Yossarian1 on 04.09.2013 at 14:56

Locrian

They have a very best a minor black influence in what is largely experimental drone / ambient music.

Ok, their formula sounds 100 times better than hipster BM
1Yossarian1 - 04.09.2013 at 15:34  
Written by !J.O.O.E.! on 04.09.2013 at 14:59

Written by 1Yossarian1 on 04.09.2013 at 14:56

Locrian

I like this band, but I don't get how they keep getting lumped into the black metal circuit. They have a very best a minor black influence in what is largely experimental drone / ambient music. Not really part of the whole "hipster" black movement either I'd say.


Hahaha dude I dont really care much for people throwing around the hipster title to bands, like I don't think you can get very technical about what bands are or should be included under that title? I only mentioned it because people seem to know what kind of sound you are referring too...

Yeah for sure Locrian is largely a drone/noise rock/ambient project. But there is definitely BM twist too it, and they do fit in quite nicely with bands like Altar of Plagues, etc. Regardless of whether the fit into any "movement" I just mentioned them, because if you like the other bands I mentioned then you would probably dig them too...

What do you think of their new album?
!J.O.O.E.! - 04.09.2013 at 15:54  
Written by 1Yossarian1 on 04.09.2013 at 15:34

Hahaha dude I dont really care much for people throwing around the hipster title to bands, like I don't think you can get very technical about what bands are or should be included under that title? I only mentioned it because people seem to know what kind of sound you are referring too...

Yeah for sure Locrian is largely a drone/noise rock/ambient project. But there is definitely BM twist too it, and they do fit in quite nicely with bands like Altar of Plagues, etc. Regardless of whether the fit into any "movement" I just mentioned them, because if you like the other bands I mentioned then you would probably dig them too...

What do you think of their new album?

I haven't heard it, but from the songs I've heard from their newest stuff they do seem to be adopting that shoegazey / post feel. I'm probably not going to like it as much as their more foreboding early stuff.
Erik M. - 05.09.2013 at 00:02  
Sick list you got here man. Our black metal tastes are really different I must say, as you like the more obscure stuff (which I have also in my most recent list), while I like pretty much every style in BM except for SDBM (which is still ridiculous in my opinion, I can't stand the crying vocals). So don't take this the wrong way when I say your list could seriously use more variety, because as of now it's pretty specific BM.

Yes, finally I can give someone suggestions again. I don't have an insane amount of recommendations like Joe, but here are the ones (1 album/band, to keep it comprehensible for you) that are all 9/10's and 10/10's in my opinion (so all favourites of mine):
- Arcturus - Aspera Hiems Symfonia (avantgarde/symphonic black)
- Caladan Brood - Echoes of Battle (epic atmospheric black)
- Dimmu Borgir - Spiritual Black Dimensions (symphonic black)
- Dordeduh - Dar De Duh (atmospheric blackened folk)
- Emperor - In the Nightside Eclipse/Anthems to the Welkin at Dusk (symhponic black) (seriously, either one of these is essential to any black metal list )
- Fen - The Malediction Fields (atmospheric blackened post)
- Graveworm - As the Angels Reach the Beauty (symphonic black)
- Inquisition - Into the Infernal Regions of the Ancient Cult (black)
- Limbonic Art - In Abhorrence Dementia (symphonic black)
- Midnight Odyssey - Funerals From The Astral Sphere (ambient atmospheric black)
- Moonspell - Wolfheart (blackened gothic folk)
- Old Man's Child - In Defiance Of Existence (melodic/symphonic black)
- Progenie Terrestre Pura - U.M.A. (ambient industrial blackened post)
- Summoning - Old Mornings Dawn/Stronghold (epic atmospheric black)
- Ulver - Bergtatt - Et Eeventyr I 5 Capitler (blackened folk)
- Vordven - Towards the Frozen Stream (melodic atmospheric black)
- Wolves in the Throne Room - Two Hunters/Diadem of 12 Stars (atmospheric black)

So yeah, still a bit more suggestions than I expected to give you, but all of those are fantastic, so definitely check 'em out.

Written by mz on 04.09.2013 at 13:17

The especial name of "Infestus - E x I I s t" makes it impossible to link it correctly to the list because of usage off "|" in the album name.


I noticed that too in my most recent list. Totally annoying, but I solved it pretty much the same way you did.
Marcel Hubregtse - 05.09.2013 at 05:23  
Written by Erik M. on 05.09.2013 at 00:02

Sick list you got here man. Our black metal tastes are really different I must say, as you like the more obscure stuff (which I have also in my most recent list), while I like pretty much every style in BM except for SDBM (which is still ridiculous in my opinion, I can't stand the crying vocals). So don't take this the wrong way when I say your list could seriously use more variety, because as of now it's pretty specific BM.

Yes, finally I can give someone suggestions again. I don't have an insane amount of recommendations like Joe, but here are the ones (1 album/band, to keep it comprehensible for you) that are all 9/10's and 10/10's in my opinion (so all favourites of mine):
- Arcturus - Aspera Hiems Symfonia (avantgarde/symphonic black)
- Caladan Brood - Echoes of Battle (epic atmospheric black)
- Dimmu Borgir - Spiritual Black Dimensions (symphonic black)
- Dordeduh - Dar De Duh (atmospheric blackened folk)
- Emperor - In the Nightside Eclipse/Anthems to the Welkin at Dusk (symhponic black) (seriously, either one of these is essential to any black metal list )
- Fen - The Malediction Fields (atmospheric blackened post)
- Graveworm - As the Angels Reach the Beauty (symphonic black)
- Inquisition - Into the Infernal Regions of the Ancient Cult (black)
- Limbonic Art - In Abhorrence Dementia (symphonic black)
- Midnight Odyssey - Funerals From The Astral Sphere (ambient atmospheric black)
- Moonspell - Wolfheart (blackened gothic folk)
- Old Man's Child - In Defiance Of Existence (melodic/symphonic black)
- Progenie Terrestre Pura - U.M.A. (ambient industrial blackened post)
- Summoning - Old Mornings Dawn/Stronghold (epic atmospheric black)
- Ulver - Bergtatt - Et Eeventyr I 5 Capitler (blackened folk)
- Vordven - Towards the Frozen Stream (melodic atmospheric black)
- Wolves in the Throne Room - Two Hunters/Diadem of 12 Stars (atmospheric black)

So yeah, still a bit more suggestions than I expected to give you, but all of those are fantastic, so definitely check 'em out.

Written by mz on 04.09.2013 at 13:17

The especial name of "Infestus - E x I I s t" makes it impossible to link it correctly to the list because of usage off "|" in the album name.


I noticed that too in my most recent list. Totally annoying, but I solved it pretty much the same way you did.


recommend some more standard bm albums, and for some bands even inferior ones. Espcieally, Ulver, Old Man's Child, Limbonic Art (although it is still good), everythigng by Inquisition, wannbeees Graveworm who have never released anything worthwhile in this genre, Dordeduh who are vastly inferior to anything those band members did in Negura Bunget, Dimmu Borgir, you recommend their first truly weak album? wth? Caladan Brood pure Summoning rip off only of interest to die hard Summoning fans, Arcturus when La Masquerade Infernale is vastly superior to this one which is all over the place and has loads of off-key moments in all the music. Let those first to be heard by classical music musicians and they'll cringe when they hear the debut and applaud the second album. That's where they reached what they tried to achieve and failed with their debut at.
Marcel Hubregtse - 05.09.2013 at 05:27  
Written by Erik M. on 05.09.2013 at 00:02

while I like pretty much every style in BM except for SDBM (which is still ridiculous in my opinion, I can't stand the crying vocals).



yet you are a huge doom metal fan and espcially of My Dying Bride. Then what you say about dsbm is totally baffling. The biggest cryer in metal ever and especially during the last eight years and live is Aaron of My Dying Bride
psykometal - 05.09.2013 at 06:20  
Since when is Arcturus's The Sham Mirrors considered black metal?

@Marcel Can't really recommend La Masquerade Infernale for a BM list (although that is by far and above their greatest album!)...
mz - 05.09.2013 at 13:14  
Written by Erik M. on 05.09.2013 at 00:02

Sick list you got here man. Our black metal tastes are really different I must say, as you like the more obscure stuff (which I have also in my most recent list), while I like pretty much every style in BM except for SDBM (which is still ridiculous in my opinion, I can't stand the crying vocals). So don't take this the wrong way when I say your list could seriously use more variety, because as of now it's pretty specific BM.

Yes, finally I can give someone suggestions again. I don't have an insane amount of recommendations like Joe, but here are the ones (1 album/band, to keep it comprehensible for you) that are all 9/10's and 10/10's in my opinion (so all favourites of mine):
- Arcturus - Aspera Hiems Symfonia (avantgarde/symphonic black)
- Caladan Brood - Echoes of Battle (epic atmospheric black)
- Dimmu Borgir - Spiritual Black Dimensions (symphonic black)
- Dordeduh - Dar De Duh (atmospheric blackened folk)
- Emperor - In the Nightside Eclipse/Anthems to the Welkin at Dusk (symhponic black) (seriously, either one of these is essential to any black metal list )
- Fen - The Malediction Fields (atmospheric blackened post)
- Graveworm - As the Angels Reach the Beauty (symphonic black)
- Inquisition - Into the Infernal Regions of the Ancient Cult (black)
- Limbonic Art - In Abhorrence Dementia (symphonic black)
- Midnight Odyssey - Funerals From The Astral Sphere (ambient atmospheric black)
- Moonspell - Wolfheart (blackened gothic folk)
- Old Man's Child - In Defiance Of Existence (melodic/symphonic black)
- Progenie Terrestre Pura - U.M.A. (ambient industrial blackened post)
- Summoning - Old Mornings Dawn/Stronghold (epic atmospheric black)
- Ulver - Bergtatt - Et Eeventyr I 5 Capitler (blackened folk)
- Vordven - Towards the Frozen Stream (melodic atmospheric black)
- Wolves in the Throne Room - Two Hunters/Diadem of 12 Stars (atmospheric black)

So yeah, still a bit more suggestions than I expected to give you, but all of those are fantastic, so definitely check 'em out.


I admit that my taste in black metal very restricted and narrowed. Obviously I prefer ambient/industrial black metal over the other sub-genres of BM. Also,it might be due to the fact that BM is relatively new genre for me and I had not enough time to check its other sub-genres.
These days, I personally am not generally interested in melodic forms of extreme metal genres like melodic death and melodic death doom and same applies to melodic black. I go to progressive metal when I have craving for melodic music.It's safe to say that melodic/symphonic/epic black metal is not really my cup of tea. I still would check your suggestions like OM'sC, Summoning,Graveworm and DB but they are not my first priority. Moreover, I generally do not like Norwegian BM bands of second wave (Ok, Mayhem,s OaC is an expectation) but if you think that Emperor is good I will give it another chance. In addition, I stated that Wolves in the Throne Room would have an album here, probably their debut . I also checked out Fen's album last year and was not interested in it at all. I recall it as really average =P Should definitely revisit that
The album which every one is praising and does seem compatible with my taste is Progenie Terrestre Pura - U.M.A. Will definitely check this out today, Thanks

Regarding SDBM, I am also not much interested in this genre tbh. Shining is a band in this genre which is really excellent and that's it for me at the moment
Anyway, thank you.Please give new recommendations if you found anything new whcih you think I might like
mz - 05.09.2013 at 13:20  
Written by psykometal on 05.09.2013 at 06:20

Since when is Arcturus's The Sham Mirrors considered black metal?

@Marcel Can't really recommend La Masquerade Infernale for a BM list (although that is by far and above their greatest album!)...

I confess that the last time I listened to that album was 2 years ago and it did sound BM. I will re-listen to that in few future days to see what happens
Tnx
Marcel Hubregtse - 05.09.2013 at 13:28  
Written by psykometal on 05.09.2013 at 06:20

@Marcel Can't really recommend La Masquerade Infernale for a BM list (although that is by far and above their greatest album!)...


Last time I listened to Arcturus' best album (La Masquerade INfernale) it was still black metal albeit rife with avantagrde stuff.
!J.O.O.E.! - 05.09.2013 at 14:49  
If you ask me The Sham Mirrors still houses enough black metal influence to warrant an inclusion on such a list.
mz - 05.09.2013 at 15:04  
Written by Marcel Hubregtse on 05.09.2013 at 13:28

Last time I listened to Arcturus' best album (La Masquerade INfernale) it was still black metal albeit rife with avantagrde stuff.


Written by !J.O.O.E.! on 05.09.2013 at 14:49

If you ask me The Sham Mirrors still houses enough black metal influence to warrant an inclusion on such a list.


Clearly I agree with you both that these two albums are still black metal, although I still prefer The Sham Mirrors over La Masquerade INfernale slightly
!J.O.O.E.! - 05.09.2013 at 15:06  
It has at least one proper black metal song on anyway.

Marcel Hubregtse - 05.09.2013 at 15:43  
Written by mz on 05.09.2013 at 15:04

, although I still prefer The Sham Mirrors over La Masquerade INfernale slightly


How dare you just kidding.
The Sham Mirrors does come close to La Masquerade Infernale for me, though.
psykometal - 05.09.2013 at 16:57  
Written by Marcel Hubregtse on 05.09.2013 at 13:28

Last time I listened to Arcturus' best album (La Masquerade INfernale) it was still black metal albeit rife with avantagrde stuff.

Huh? How can you call that album a BM album?! The only moment on that album that could really be considered BM is the blast beating in the intro to "Alone", and the once or twice used black metal vocals. Other than that the album is pretty much solid Avantgarde...
Marcel Hubregtse - 05.09.2013 at 17:13  
Quite a few black metal chord progression and riffing going on as well.
!J.O.O.E.! - 05.09.2013 at 17:36  
Written by psykometal on 05.09.2013 at 16:57

solid Avantgarde...

Define "solid avant-garde." Most of time it's an avant-garde form of something else. Look at Ved Buens Ende, some of Virus' stuff and so on. There's definitely strong elements of black metal in Arcturus up to their final album, which itself is totally free of black metal influence if my memory serves.
Marcel Hubregtse - 05.09.2013 at 17:52  
Indeed avant-garde is not a stand alone term/genre. You have avnat-garde black, avant-garde death, avant-garde jazz, but not avant-garde as such.
psykometal - 05.09.2013 at 18:03  
We'll just have to agree to disagree, since I do believe that Avantgarde can be a standalone genre, just like Progressive. However since you two disagree with me, then to put it in your terms, LMF and TSM are Avantgarde Progressive metal, not Avantgarde BM. Guess we just have entirely too different ideas on what BM and Avantgarde (or Avantgarde Progressive) are cuz I don't hear anywhere near enough BM on LMF or TSM to call either of those albums "BM".
!J.O.O.E.! - 05.09.2013 at 18:14  
Avant-garde progressive metal? I'm pretty sure there's no such thing and has never been. By definition an avant-garde metal band is at least already progressive in nature, typically geared even more toward experimental (hence the term avant-garde being used instead of progressive) so using the term progressive is pretty unnecessary in my opinion, unless we're talking about prog-rock which has a more defined set of rules (but we're not, we're talking about progressive metal which is more loose considering the generally large amount of genres it can be applied to, and even then it's usually applied to bands with long songs and bit more convoluted structure). Basically there's very little in Arcturus which lends itself to what is generally considered progressive metal, but lots in what is considered avant-garde. There is however still strains of black metal's aesthetics and a few technical points left over until the final album.
Mr. Doctor - 05.09.2013 at 18:48  
Way to rip that list Marcel hahahaha. Welp... I like Ulver's debut. xD
Anyways, nice list mz.
psykometal - 05.09.2013 at 18:53  
Written by !J.O.O.E.! on 05.09.2013 at 18:14

Avant-garde progressive metal? I'm pretty sure there's no such thing and has never been. By definition an avant-garde metal band is at least already progressive in nature, typically geared even more toward experimental (hence the term avant-garde being used instead of progressive) so using the term progressive is pretty unnecessary in my opinion, unless we're talking about prog-rock which has a more defined set of rules (but we're not, we're talking about progressive metal which is more loose considering the generally large amount of genres it can be applied to, and even then it's usually applied to bands with long songs and bit more convoluted structure). Basically there's very little in Arcturus which lends itself to what is generally considered progressive metal, but lots in what is considered avant-garde. There is however still strains of black metal's aesthetics and a few technical points left over until the final album.

And I agree with you that "Avantgarde Progressive" is absurd due to the very nature of the term "Avantgarde". However you and Marcel appear to be indicating that "Avantarde Metal" can not be a standalone genre, that the term "Avantgarde" can only be used as a prefix (ie Avantgarde Black, Avantgarde Death, Avantgarde Thrash, etc.), which I disagree with. So I was merely attempting to indicate how absurd I feel calling those two albums "Avantgarde BM" is.

And I agree there are SOME BM aesthetics and moments in those album, but nowhere near enough to call those albums "Avantgarde BM", just "Avantgarde Metal".
!J.O.O.E.! - 05.09.2013 at 18:56  
Written by psykometal on 05.09.2013 at 18:53

And I agree with you that "Avantgarde Progressive" is absurd due to the very nature of the term "Avantgarde". However you and Marcel appear to be indicating that "Avantarde Metal" can not be a standalone genre, that the term "Avantgarde" can only be used as a prefix (ie Avantgarde Black, Avantgarde Death, Avantgarde Thrash, etc.), which I disagree with. So I was merely attempting to indicate how absurd I feel calling those two albums "Avantgarde BM" is.

And I agree there are SOME BM aesthetics and moments in those album, but nowhere near enough to call those albums "Avantgarde BM", just "Avantgarde Metal".

Not really sure how your argument applies. avant-garde black is a thing (a very common thing). Avant-garde prog is not. What point are you trying to make? Due to its vague nature and lack of uniform qualities "avant-garde" is very rarely a standalone genre. The very reason Arcturus could be considered avant-gard black is because the black elements are so distorted. That's the nature of avant-garde music. Regardless the black elements are most definitely there.
psykometal - 05.09.2013 at 19:10  
Written by !J.O.O.E.! on 05.09.2013 at 18:56

Not really sure how your argument applies. avant-garde black is a thing (a very common thing). Avant-garde prog is not. What point are you trying to make? Due to its vague nature and lack of uniform qualities "avant-garde" is very rarely a standalone genre. The very reason Arcturus could be considered avant-gard black is because the black elements are so distorted. That's the nature of avant-garde music. Regardless the black elements are most definitely there.

Not saying "Avantgarde BM" isn't a thing (I know it's very common), I'm saying that I disagree that the BM elements in LMI and TSM are not enough to warrant calling those albums "Avantgarde BM". Imo those albums are "Avantgarde Metal", the only full length album in their discog I consider "Avantgarde BM" was Aspera Hiems Symfonia. Thought that was fairly clear in my agument, but apparently not. *shrug*
!J.O.O.E.! - 05.09.2013 at 19:14  
Written by psykometal on 05.09.2013 at 19:10

Not saying "Avantgarde BM" isn't a thing (I know it's very common), I'm saying that I disagree that the BM elements in LMI and TSM are enough to warrant calling those albums "Avantgarde BM". Imo those albums are "Avantgarde Metal", the only full length album in their discog I consider "Avantgarde BM" was Aspera Hiems Symfonia. Thought that was fairly clear in my agument, but apparently not. *shrug*

I got your argument, I just don't understand your point about "avant-garde progressive metal." It doesn't illustrate your point at all as it implies that avant-garde black can never exist, not that it doesn't exist in this particular instance which is what your whole point was about.
psykometal - 05.09.2013 at 19:47  
Written by !J.O.O.E.! on 05.09.2013 at 19:14

I got your argument, I just don't understand your point about "avant-garde progressive metal." It doesn't illustrate your point at all as it implies that avant-garde black can never exist, not that it doesn't exist in this particular instance which is what your whole point was about.

Oh that. Well as I said, y'all appeared to be indicating that "using 'Avantgarde' as a standalone genre is not right, because it's only a prefix". So I wasn't trying to argue that we should call them "Avantgarde Progressive" (as MA does), just that if they can't be called Avantgarde Metal, and I don't agree with calling them Avantgarde BM then what else could I call them that is NOT Avantgarde BM and is NOT Avantgarde Metal and adheres to y'all's belief that Avantgarde HAS to be used a prefix? The only other prefix usage I could think of, that even remotely made more sense than Avantgarde BM, would be Avantgarde Progressive. Not saying at all that "Avantgarde BM" can't exist, just that "Avantgarde BM" is the wrong genre tag for Arcturus as of LMI.
mz - 05.09.2013 at 19:48  
Written by Mr. Doctor on 05.09.2013 at 18:48

Way to rip that list Marcel hahahaha. Welp... I like Ulver's debut. xD
Anyways, nice list mz.

Thank you, I'm enjoying the argument despite the fact that Joe and Marcel can defend my side better than myself
mz - 05.09.2013 at 19:59  
We all agree that there are some BM elements throne into TSM. The point is that we can not measure the amount of this elements. I mean, we have botanist called avat black here. One can not say that the amount of BM elements in botanist's sound is sufficient enough to call them BM and on the other hand,that they are not enough in the case of TSM. There is not a measure and standard to compare everything with it in this regard.It is Avantgarde and it has BM aesthetic feeling so I think it's Avantgarde BM.
!J.O.O.E.! - 05.09.2013 at 20:00  
Written by psykometal on 05.09.2013 at 19:47

Oh that. Well as I said, y'all appeared to be indicating that "using 'Avantgarde' as a standalone genre is not right, because it's only a prefix". So I wasn't trying to argue that we should call them "Avantgarde Progressive" (as MA does), just that if they can't be called Avantgarde Metal, and I don't agree with calling them Avantgarde BM then what else could I call them that is NOT Avantgarde BM and is NOT Avantgarde Metal and adheres to y'all's belief that Avantgarde HAS to be used a prefix? The only other prefix usage I could think of, that even remotely made more sense than Avantgarde BM, would be Avantgarde Progressive. Not saying at all that "Avantgarde BM" can't exist, just that "Avantgarde BM" is the wrong genre tag for Arcturus as of LMI.

Well I never said it could never be used as a standalone genre, only that it is rare. Because Arcturus retains much of its early black metal style avant-garde becomes the modifier for those black metal elements.

I don't know why avant-progressive would be the first leap you would make even if it was just to make some kind of point. Arcturus clearly has black metal in the majority of their albums, but it doesn't have any kind of progressive metal in. It seems a very confused and laboured point to me.
mz - 05.09.2013 at 20:07  
I had prepared myself for debates on P.H.O.B.O.S album not TSM
Apothecary - 05.09.2013 at 20:16  
Well I'd say that me, Joe, and Rodrigo (Mr. Doctor) are probably your main guys to go to for all the weird, experimental BM. For this list, might I suggest...
1. Hail Spirit Noir: Pneuma (more prog rock-ish than black metal, but still a really fantastic album)
2. Kvelertak: Meir (punk-ish black metal, gets into that whole "black and roll" sound)
3. Klabautamann: Merkur (good German atmospheric BM)
4. Any Meads Of Asphodel album... The Murder Of Jesus The Jew is usually hailed as the best, but I prefer Sonderkommando personally

These are all on my Unorthodox Black Metal list by the way, which I see you've checked out already
As for Oranssi Pazuzu, Kosmonument is much crazier and darkly psychedelic than Muukalainen Puhuu. And with The Ruins Of Beverast, it really just depends on what you're looking for... no album is bad, pre-Foulest is just more blackened, and post-Foulest is more doom-y.
psykometal - 05.09.2013 at 21:06  
Written by !J.O.O.E.! on 05.09.2013 at 20:00

Well I never said it could never be used as a standalone genre, only that it is rare. Because Arcturus retains much of its early black metal style avant-garde becomes the modifier for those black metal elements.

I don't know why avant-progressive would be the first leap you would make even if it was just to make some kind of point. Arcturus clearly has black metal in the majority of their albums, but it doesn't have any kind of progressive metal in. It seems a very confused and laboured point to me.

Well it wasn't very labored in my head, it made perfect sense. Unfortunately it became labored because you didn't understand my point.

My main point was that I disagree with the both of you entirely that the BM elements in those 2 albums are anywhere near enough to just modify the BM tag. Imo, the albums are Avantgarde Metal, not Avantgarde Black Metal.
Erik M. - 06.09.2013 at 00:10  
Written by Marcel Hubregtse on 05.09.2013 at 05:23

recommend some more standard bm albums, and for some bands even inferior ones. Espcieally, Ulver, Old Man's Child, Limbonic Art (although it is still good), everythigng by Inquisition, wannbeees Graveworm who have never released anything worthwhile in this genre, Dordeduh who are vastly inferior to anything those band members did in Negura Bunget, Dimmu Borgir, you recommend their first truly weak album? wth? Caladan Brood pure Summoning rip off only of interest to die hard Summoning fans, Arcturus when La Masquerade Infernale is vastly superior to this one which is all over the place and has loads of off-key moments in all the music. Let those first to be heard by classical music musicians and they'll cringe when they hear the debut and applaud the second album. That's where they reached what they tried to achieve and failed with their debut at.


So what if I recommended supposedly "standard" BM albums? If he (mz) hasn't heard them and the style appeals to him, then it's all that matters since I gave him suggestions, not anyone else. If the style doesn't appeal to him, then he won't check 'em out, no harm done. Whether these albums/bands are standard or not is irrelevant; it matters that the music is good. Funnily enough, lots of albums on this list are quite standard as well when it comes to the BM taste of staff/elites on MS, which is also becoming quite predictable and thus boring. Unlike me, it seems you don't enjoy symphonic/atmospheric BM, so that's why a lot of my recommendations aren't your cup of tea. It doesn't mean they're not good. Obviously in the end it's mainly subjective and I happen to like all of those albums. Inquisition is band you either like or hate, mainly due to the vocals of course, but musically it's great (although the stuff they do does sounds pretty similar, I'll give you that). That Ulver album is a classic, the Old Man's Child album is easily the best by that band and the same goes for Limbonic Art (some might prefer the debut I guess, but I haven't heard anything except for the first two albums). Spiritual Black Dimensions is easily DB's best album for me, so can't really comment on that. Dordeduh is great too, even if Negura Bunget is better (still have to check out Om, to know what all the fuss is about ). You're probably right about Summoning and Caladan Brood, seeing mz's BM taste, but who knows he might enjoy it. Although you don't really need to be a die-hard Summoning fan in order to enjoy CB. About Arcturus, I also think La Masquerade Infernale is (slightly) superior to the debut, but since I felt it has too few BM in it I didn't recommend that one. The Sham Mirrors is my least favourite of the three, believe it or not.

Written by Marcel Hubregtse on 05.09.2013 at 05:27

yet you are a huge doom metal fan and espcially of My Dying Bride. Then what you say about dsbm is totally baffling. The biggest cryer in metal ever and especially during the last eight years and live is Aaron of My Dying Bride


Last DBM is listened to is Pensées Nocturnes and those kind of crying vocals are TOTALLY different from the whiny vocals that Aaron from MDB does. Watching From a Distance might be a brilliant album (we both agree on that ) but it also has whiny vocals, although a bit different from MDB, but still way more similar to MDB than MDB is similar to DSBM vocals. Also, in doom metal there are, as far as I'm aware, rarely vocalists that do crying vocals such as in Pensées Nocturnes and Gris (listened to this briefly, but the vocals ruined it for me).

Written by mz on 05.09.2013 at 13:14

I admit that my taste in black metal very restricted and narrowed. Obviously I prefer ambient/industrial black metal over the other sub-genres of BM. Also,it might be due to the fact that BM is relatively new genre for me and I had not enough time to check its other sub-genres.
These days, I personally am not generally interested in melodic forms of extreme metal genres like melodic death and melodic death doom and same applies to melodic black. I go to progressive metal when I have craving for melodic music.It's safe to say that melodic/symphonic/epic black metal is not really my cup of tea. I still would check your suggestions like OM'sC, Summoning,Graveworm and DB but they are not my first priority. Moreover, I generally do not like Norwegian BM bands of second wave (Ok, Mayhem,s OaC is an expectation) but if you think that Emperor is good I will give it another chance. In addition, I stated that Wolves in the Throne Room would have an album here, probably their debut . I also checked out Fen's album last year and was not interested in it at all. I recall it as really average =P Should definitely revisit that
The album which every one is praising and does seem compatible with my taste is Progenie Terrestre Pura - U.M.A. Will definitely check this out today, Thanks

Regarding SDBM, I am also not much interested in this genre tbh. Shining is a band in this genre which is really excellent and that's it for me at the moment
Anyway, thank you.Please give new recommendations if you found anything new whcih you think I might like


Well, I only gave you those suggestions because those are my favourites. If I were to make a list similar to this one, those albums would all be in it. A couple of your albums (of course #1, which I recently discovered) from this list would be in it too. And indeed our tastes differ quite a lot, since I enjoy atmospheric/symphonic BM the most. That being said, Industrial/ambient BM like a lot of albums in this list, is pretty new to me as well, so this list is a nice place for me to find out more stuff. Anyway, seeing as I included the genres by my suggestions, it would be easy for you to know which albums you would possibly like. By the way, even Marcel would agree when I say Emperor's first 2 albums are classics, so do check 'em out. Strange you didn't like Fen... for me their debut is excellent in pretty much every way (some of the clean vocals get a bit whiny/poppy sometimes though). And yes, U.M.A. is a great album, easily one of the best albums this year for me. Let me know what you think of it. One last thing, do you have a minimum rating for the albums on this list? Just curious.

Written by psykometal on 05.09.2013 at 21:06

My main point was that I disagree with the both of you entirely that the BM elements in those 2 albums are anywhere near enough to just modify the BM tag. Imo, the albums are Avantgarde Metal, not Avantgarde Black Metal.


Having read this discussion I agree with psykometal about there not being enough BM elements in LMI to call it avantgarde BM and I would also call it simply "avantgarde metal". I feel there's more BM in TSM however so I'm not sure how I'd label that one (of course Radical Cut is definitely BM). The debut of Arcturus has actually way less avantgarde and way more BM than any other Arcturus album, so that one is clearly avantgarde (symphonic?) BM. Oh, and I agree with Joe about labelling music "avantgarde progressive", which indeed does seem a bit... unnecessary. That being said, there are definitely some differences between those genres, but I wouldn't call Arcturus progressive at all, just avantgarde (black) metal.
mz - 06.09.2013 at 16:04  
Written by Apothecary on 05.09.2013 at 20:16

Well I'd say that me, Joe, and Rodrigo (Mr. Doctor) are probably your main guys to go to for all the weird, experimental BM. For this list, might I suggest...
1. Hail Spirit Noir: Pneuma (more prog rock-ish than black metal, but still a really fantastic album)
2. Kvelertak: Meir (punk-ish black metal, gets into that whole "black and roll" sound)
3. Klabautamann: Merkur (good German atmospheric BM)
4. Any Meads Of Asphodel album... The Murder Of Jesus The Jew is usually hailed as the best, but I prefer Sonderkommando personally

These are all on my Unorthodox Black Metal list by the way, which I see you've checked out already
As for Oranssi Pazuzu, Kosmonument is much crazier and darkly psychedelic than Muukalainen Puhuu. And with The Ruins Of Beverast, it really just depends on what you're looking for... no album is bad, pre-Foulest is just more blackened, and post-Foulest is more doom-y.

I actually had you three in my mind for getting some suggestions when I made this list
I have Hail Spirit Noir but never gave it a proper listen. Their formula is interesting for me since I like prog/psychedelic rock. For this reason, I should also go for Oranssi Pazuzu.
Checking your list is "in progress" for me now as I downloaded a few albums from it, including Kvelertak and Meads Of Asphodel (both of them, two albums). In few days I will be done with them
In addition, I re-listened to Foulest by TRoB yesterday and liked it a lot more than before but it is not still going to be included here. Moreover, I listened to most of unlock the shrine and those were 7.8/10 for me. that album was a very but again, I do not think it would be included here(despite the fact that I should check it more properly)
Thank you and keep giving suggestions if you found anything interesting within the genre
mz - 06.09.2013 at 16:25  
Written by Erik M. on 06.09.2013 at 00:10

Well, I only gave you those suggestions because those are my favourites. If I were to make a list similar to this one, those albums would all be in it. A couple of your albums (of course #1, which I recently discovered) from this list would be in it too. And indeed our tastes differ quite a lot, since I enjoy atmospheric/symphonic BM the most. That being said, Industrial/ambient BM like a lot of albums in this list, is pretty new to me as well, so this list is a nice place for me to find out more stuff. Anyway, seeing as I included the genres by my suggestions, it would be easy for you to know which albums you would possibly like. By the way, even Marcel would agree when I say Emperor's first 2 albums are classics, so do check 'em out. Strange you didn't like Fen... for me their debut is excellent in pretty much every way (some of the clean vocals get a bit whiny/poppy sometimes though). And yes, U.M.A. is a great album, easily one of the best albums this year for me. Let me know what you think of it. One last thing, do you have a minimum rating for the albums on this list? Just curious.

As I stated before, I am really thankful that you gave me those recommendations. In fact, all type of recommendations are welcomed as long as they are not misleading and yours do not fall into this category. This situation is exactly like when I gave you death metal recommendations for your list: although I knew that DM is not your favorite type of extreme metal, I recommended you to check them and you gave me suggestions on melodic/epic/symphonic BM despite the fact that you knew I am not generally an avid fan of these types of BM. No harm done and I will actually check your recommendations
Regarding fen's album, I was not much into BM when I checked it and my taste in the genre has evolved a lot. In the other words, I might actually like it these days
To answer your question on my minimum rating of albums included here, I must say that the lowest ratings are 8.4-8.5 alkerdeel, lord mantis and the axis of perdition.These albums have actually grown a lot on me,especially "the axis of perdition"s album since I did not like this band initially at all. These rating probably would go higher as they grow on me even more.
nille - 13.09.2013 at 18:14  
mz - 13.09.2013 at 18:53  
Written by nille on 13.09.2013 at 18:14



Erik M. - 15.09.2013 at 02:22  
Written by mz on 13.09.2013 at 18:53

Written by nille on 13.09.2013 at 18:14






Yet the thumbs up is only imaginary seeing as he hasn't really given a +1 to this list, which also seems to be the case in quite a few other lists he commented on.
!J.O.O.E.! - 15.09.2013 at 02:38  
Written by Erik M. on 15.09.2013 at 02:22

Yet the thumbs up is only imaginary seeing as he hasn't really given a +1 to this list, which also seems to be the case in quite a few other lists he commented on.

Maybe he just doesn't give a crap about an affectation that is an official "thumbs up"
mz - 15.09.2013 at 15:03  
Thumbs up in any form is appreciated
Updates to the list: I checked some of the suggestions in past few days and added "The Meads of Asphodel - The Murder Of Jesus The Jew" 2 days ago. I also went through Wolves in The Throne Room's discography and am now torn between their four albums :\ They are all great but I would probably add their "black cascade" or "celestial lineage". Moreover, I am considering adding "aderlating-spear gold seraphim bone" but I skeptical that it could be qualified as black metal. If anyone has opinion on this subject, please share here.
Erik M. - 17.09.2013 at 15:42  
Have you heard Verdunkeln's debut? Would seem to be your cup of tea.
mz - 17.09.2013 at 15:50  
Written by Erik M. on 17.09.2013 at 15:42

Have you heard Verdunkeln's debut? Would seem to be your cup of tea.

I heard it once, maybe 6 months ago and do not remember being that impressed but I'm trying to re-check it.

Advertise on Metal Storm
Pages: [1] 2 3


Login or register to post here.



Similar topics

Forum Topic Similarity Started
Lists Favorite Black Metal Albums 7 14.03.2014 by Aristarchos
Lists My Favorite Atmospheric Black Metal Albums 7 24.05.2012 by MechanisT
Lists My Favorite Black Metal Albums Of 2013!! 7 02.01.2014 by Góral
Lists MZ'x Most Favorite Progressive Metal Albums 6.5 21.07.2013 by mz
Metal arena Top 10-20 Favorite Black Metal Albums 6 18.08.2008 by Dangerboner



Hits total: 2652 | This month: 122