Religion: Double Standards
Original post
Posted by APOHAKC, 08.04.2008 - 15:49
Now to the point, in every day life I see a lot things and contradictories that are pissing me off, whole idea for a thread came when I saw Dutch movie Fitna, you probably already heard about it, it is about Islam, scenarist was accused for hate speech while movie is called racist?! (since when religion and race are connected) and hateful. In the movie, they put strong anti-muslim accent, doesn't matter does I support or not whole concept of the movie, to sum it up, man that made a movie was literally impaled in the media because of the whole project.
Also, we have a bunch of movies that never ever got permission to be shown on tv about anti-judaism, (and please do not invert my words, anti-judaism and anti-semitism is not one the same), they were immediately shown as racist and hateful in the media, not rarely people were even imprisoned for making them.
Now, we have a bunch of anti-Christian movies on tv, that no one never ever bash as racist, that are shown daily on tv, no one ever question religious correctness of those movies, truth, mostly Christian by birth made those movies, but again, as someone declare himself as an anti-Christian what difference does it makes?
Question is, WHY is it ok to bash on Christianity and it is NOT ok to bash on any other religion and immediately it is characterized as hateful speech?
Examples in music, Ukrainian band Nokturnal Mortum had both anti-judaistic and anti-Christian lyrics, no one ever question anti-Christian part cause that's ok, but everyone bitch about anti-judaism?! What's with that?
80% of you are openly anti-Christian, and bash on Christianity on this forum and real life most probably, same as some metalstormers I know, once, I said to one member in real life damn they want to build stupid mosque in the middle of the town and he looked at me like that I said Gods knows what and told me don't be a racist (again?!), but never ever he said anything to me when I dozens of times said that Cathedral in the center of the town should be burned? (yeah, a little of trve metal behavior..)
Once on this forum member said to other member stop with you judaistic crap, I remember that very well, post was deleted and he got warned for racism again, but I also saw DOZENS of time members saying similar things like stop your Christian crap to other members and no one ever got warned for that.
Why is it ok to bitch about Christianity and it is blasphemy to bitch about all other organized religions (especially Islam and Judaism)?!?
Looks like a double standard to me...
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| Cal Wolvington Account deleted |
Cal Wolvington
Account deleted Written by mojo on 22.03.2012 at 17:05 I am not talking Judeo-Christian religion, their God is anthropomorphic, even if to a lesser extent than the gods of Hinduism. I am here to talk philosophy 
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| mojo Posts: 93  |
Written by [user id=105293] on 22.03.2012 at 17:20 Disappearing socks - Faeries? If they exist, it isn't necessary to explain the disappearance of the socks. People's unaccountable mood swings - the moon and the planets? If they have this effect, no other explanation is necessary. Surely then, both of these are as un-arbitrary as "God", and anyone believing in God but dismissing faeries and astrology is guilty of as gross a double standard as dismissing someone else's God while violently defending one's own.
---- Yeah. No. Wait, what was the question?
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| Oaken Hipster Posts: 1322  |
Written by X-Ray Rod on 22.03.2012 at 13:47 If they have been asked to follow God's path and they turned their backs on it, they deserve to go to hell. And BTW a religious Good man is definitely better than the atheistic Good man, because religion has some crucial that atheists don't abide to.
---- In that case, man is only air as well.
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| mojo Posts: 93 |
Written by [user id=105293] on 22.03.2012 at 17:43 No natural explanation? A self-manifesting infinitely-scaling universe as an alternative to God is not a natural explanation? Apparently, "God did it" is as arbitrary as any other lack of objectively observable evidence...
---- Yeah. No. Wait, what was the question?
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| mojo Posts: 93 |
Written by Oaken on 22.03.2012 at 17:49 and that is / they are...?
---- Yeah. No. Wait, what was the question?
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| Oaken Hipster Posts: 1322 |
Written by mojo on 22.03.2012 at 17:05 Zeus comes to Earth and fucks human maidens. What kind of God is that? How can you compare him to God(Which is also known by Jehovah and Allah)?
---- In that case, man is only air as well.
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| Oaken Hipster Posts: 1322 |
Written by Troy Killjoy on 22.03.2012 at 03:15 When religion is followed closely, it makes society better. And BTW have you ever tried to read about the first Muslims? Can you deny their society was superior to any others? If there was no way to prove God, then I think that the morals and actions of those person are proof.
---- In that case, man is only air as well.
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| Oaken Hipster Posts: 1322 |
Written by mojo on 22.03.2012 at 17:52 Okay, you an atheist? Please tell me what you forbid yourself from doing?
---- In that case, man is only air as well.
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| Oaken Hipster Posts: 1322 |
Written by [user id=105293] on 22.03.2012 at 17:56 I meant the opposite. Morals of religious people and atheists are the same, but the limits/restrictions differ. Atheists do some bad things and deny that they're bad.
---- In that case, man is only air as well.
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| mojo Posts: 93 |
Written by [user id=105293] on 22.03.2012 at 16:56 Written by [user id=105293] on 22.03.2012 at 17:20 Written by [user id=105293] on 22.03.2012 at 17:54 You may be contradicting yourself, but then all of this may be taking place inside my overactive imagination...
---- Yeah. No. Wait, what was the question?
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| Oaken Hipster Posts: 1322 |
Written by [user id=105293] on 22.03.2012 at 18:03 Suicide bombers are pieces of brainwashed shit. Those aren't religious people. Terrorism has no religion, and if you think Islam says "Go bomb infidels." then I think you should learn more. Al Qaeda is nothing but a dirty American game. So, if you exclude suicide bombers for the mentioned reasons, I'd like you to reanswer me.
---- In that case, man is only air as well.
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| Cal Wolvington Account deleted |
Cal Wolvington
Account deleted Written by mojo on 22.03.2012 at 18:00 It's your imagination  Trust me, I am a doctor. But srsly, maybe I didn't explain things well enough... too tired to try again at the moment.
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| Oaken Hipster Posts: 1322 |
Written by [user id=105293] on 22.03.2012 at 18:15 There isn't. But there are acts that atheists do without care. And Al Qaeda aren't religiously motivated. Please don't teach me MY religion. I know what I'm asked to do and what I'm not, and I'm not allowed to hurt people who don't DIRECTLY hurt me.
---- In that case, man is only air as well.
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| Oaken Hipster Posts: 1322 |
Written by [user id=105293] on 22.03.2012 at 18:15 Anyways, I've given you everything I have. After all, I'm nothing but a mere kid, and I don't know much about philosophy, but I have my own reasons to believe. Some of my arguments may have been insolent (I felt that from Mr. Doctor's posts.), but I tried to be as subjective as possible. After all, this story - with its simplicity and silliness - sums it up for me: Long ago an Atheist did not believe the existence of God. He asked a scholar for a debate about the existence of God. Among the questions are: "Does God exist?" and "If God exists then where is God?" Then they decided when and where the debate takes place. The Atheist and the villagers were waiting for the scholar, but the scholar did not come right on time. When the Atheist and the villagers thought that the scholar will not come for the debate, then the scholar showed up. "I am sorry to keep you waiting for so long. But the rain is so heavy so the river floods. The bridge drifted away so I could not cross it. Thank God suddenly there was a big tree fell down. Then the branches cut out by themselves so the trunk was branchless. After that the trunk was cut and a hole was created so it became a boat. So I used the boat and crossed the river," said the scholar. The Atheist and the villagers were laughing. The Atheist said to the villagers, "This scholar is mad. How can a tree became a boat by itself with no one made it? How can a boat exist with no maker who made it?" The villagers were laughing out loud. After the people calmed down, the scholar said, "If you believe that the boat could not exist without its maker, then how could you believe the earth, sky, and its contents exist without its creator? Which is the most difficult to make? Making a boat or creating the earth, sky, and its contents? Hearing that, they realized that they trapped with their own statement. "Then answer my second question," said the Atheist. "If God exists, why can't He be seen? Where is God?" The Atheist thought since he cannot see God then God does not exist. The scholar slapped the Atheist's cheek hardly so the Atheist felt so much pain. "Why did you slap me? It's very painful" The scholar asked, "There is no pain. I cannot see pain. Where is pain?" "The pain is here," the Atheist pointed his cheek. "No, I cannot see pain. Do you see the pain?" asked the scholar to the villagers. The villagers said, "No!" "So, though we cannot see the pain does not mean that the pain does not exist. So is the God. Just because we cannot see the God does not mean that God does not exist. Though we cannot see Him, but we can see His creations." Said the scholar.
---- In that case, man is only air as well.
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| mojo Posts: 93 |
Written by Oaken on 22.03.2012 at 17:55 When religion is followed closely, it can make things worse for many people, especially those who choose not to follow - and let's be clear on this: religion is a choice. I deny that any society (with the exception of the most nurturant and natural) is or was superior. Strict patriarchal societies in fact are worse (more cruel, less nurturant) than most. Written by Oaken on 22.03.2012 at 17:55 I forbid myself from doing anything my conscience tells me is wrong. You may call that the voice of god, I simply call it a consciencs, and I believe every living creature has an innate knowledge of what is right and wrong; I also deny this is any kind of proof of god. I may have to back out of this chat for a while as I can't keep up with the typing. See where the thread goes next... I may be back.
---- Yeah. No. Wait, what was the question?
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| mojo Posts: 93 |
I love the way religious people say "(my) Religion makes the world better! Prove me wrong!" and when someone mentions war, terrorism, torture, purges and executions they say "Well those people are not tr00" Where I come from, it's called the "No True Scotsman" argument, and it's rubbish: Imagine Hamish McDonald, a Scotsman, sitting down with his Glasgow Morning Herald and seeing an article about how the "Brighton Sex Maniac Strikes Again." Hamish is shocked and declares that "No Scotsman would do such a thing." The next day he sits down to read his Glasgow Morning Herald again and this time finds an article about an Aberdeen man whose brutal actions make the Brighton sex maniac seem almost gentlemanly. This fact shows that Hamish was wrong in his opinion but is he going to admit this? Not likely. This time he says, "No true Scotsman would do such a thing." ?Antony Flew, Thinking About Thinking http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/No_true_Scotsman I won't get in to quoting the bible and koran on the subject of killing unbelievers because I really can't see the point. I've had that debate before and it always leads to acres of quoting from carefully-chosen translations of scholarly interpretations, so no. But the verses are there for anyone to see if they open the books.
---- Yeah. No. Wait, what was the question?
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| X-Ray Rod Skandino Staff Posts: 18278  |
Written by Oaken on 22.03.2012 at 17:49 I somehow feel that I shouldn't answer but it doesn't matter to me. I feel sad when I see someone like you who can't see the goodness of someone else without looking at his/her spiritual background and truly thinks that if they lack any of it, they should go to hell. You refuse to think that a non-believer who is a great person at heart is worthy of a good afterlife simply because of his lack of belief. You refuse to believe in equality between men with different beliefs. You think it's ok that someone who hasn't done anything wrong goes to hell and suffers without any real reason. You think it's ok to condemn an inocent person. It's sad. It's really sad.
---- Written by BloodTears on 19.08.2011 at 18:29 Written by Milena on 20.06.2012 at 10:49
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| Oaken Hipster Posts: 1322 |
Written by X-Ray Rod on 23.03.2012 at 00:20 Not believing in God is not something wrong? It is the ultimate sin. And atheistic people don't have limits and rules. They have no sin, no limits, they can do whatever they want. I have atheist friends who have no limits. They can fuck, masturbate, watch porn, do all sorts of filth, get drunk and not feel guilt. Those have morals? The world around you is proof behind God's existence. God sent many prophets who had a warning. Those atheists HAVE BEEN WARNED BY THEIR CREATOR.
---- In that case, man is only air as well.
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| X-Ray Rod Skandino Staff Posts: 18278 |
Written by Oaken on 23.03.2012 at 00:32 You think that all non-believers are the same. You think that guilt, rules, limits and morals aren't something that a non-believer can achieve to have. That is where you are wrong. I hope that time will make you realise the deep content of the words you have written. I hope you will travel and meet different people and gain experience and wisdom from all of them. I hope you will see different cultures and in the end realise that they are all similar... Because a good heart worthy of a paradise can come from the chest of any man, woman and child. You are young, I'm sure time will do its work.
---- Written by BloodTears on 19.08.2011 at 18:29 Written by Milena on 20.06.2012 at 10:49
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| Troy Killjoy perfunctionist Staff Posts: 21306  |
Written by Oaken on 22.03.2012 at 17:55 I was actually going to provide a legitimate argument here but after reading your following posts I realize you're simply a close-minded religious nut so you're definitely not worth more than this quote.
---- "Wise men talk because they have something to say; fools because they have to say something."
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| Angelic Storm Melodious Posts: 6675  |
Written by Oaken on 23.03.2012 at 00:32 That is just nonsense. I am an athiest, and I don't do any of those things you've just described. Okay, the not having sex thing isn't entirely through my own choice, but if I were to have sex it would only be in the context of love. But that's because that is what feels right for me, not because I fear I'll be damned to hell if I didn't do that. I know for a fact, that many religious people have bogus morals, and commit all of, or at least some of, the acts you've just mentioned. As well as just being vile, horrible people in general. I have never hurt anyone in my whole life, and almost certainly never will. So these Islamists who stone women to death for "falling in love with the wrong man" and executing homosexuals are more worthy of a place in heaven than me? If so, then I would have no wish to live by the rules of a merciless, tyrannical god who permits some of the most obscene acts imaginable, whilst damning people to hell for no other reason than being an unbeliever. It always irks me when religious people act as if they have a monopoly on morals. Religious people are capable of acting in very immoral ways, just as non-religious people can be kind, decent, upstanding members of society. Religious people do not have a monopoly on morals, or goodness, no matter what they might think.
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| Branzig Posts: 891  |
Written by Troy Killjoy on 23.03.2012 at 01:25 I wish there were more open minded religious people out there...I actually REALLY like discussing these things...but I always just get angry bigotry thrown in my face, and all-knowing, greater-than-thou attitude. It's a shame...these topics make for seriously in-depth GREAT conversations...as long as both sides remain open to each other's opinions and facts.
---- In Grind We Crust
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| R'Vannith ghedengi Elite Posts: 3099  |
Written by Oaken on 23.03.2012 at 00:32 Although you are being harangued on all sides let me ask you something. What gives you the right to condemn those around you for their lack of belief? Simply because you believe in a creator figure does not grant you the authority to dictate how others should behave, what they should consider right or wrong/moral or immoral. You may well consider some things that atheists do to be sinful, whether correctly justified or not, but that is merely your own opinion. To claim that you are passing on some sort of definitive and unarguable message from your divine creator suggests a high level of patronizing, as if you are here to right the wrongs and sway those heathens from their invalid thoughts and ways of life. I believe many religions preach tolerance do they not? Where is your tolerance? I believe in a creator figure, but not in the sense of actual existence, but as an idea that produces positive effects within society. Most seem to focus on the negative when it comes to religion, your attack on the beliefs of others isn't really helping your cause.
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| R'Vannith ghedengi Elite Posts: 3099 |
Written by Troy Killjoy on 23.03.2012 at 01:25 I think that's a very unfair judgement. He seems to be able to express his beliefs very coherently, he isn't a 'nut'. Close-minded perhaps but I would hazard a guess that this is due more to his upbringing than his state of sanity.
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